AK hands on loose table

[NRS]

This is not a specific hand, but an example of the sorts of plays that I've been struggling with lately. The setting is a loose passive $1/$2 game online.

I receive AKo in EP and raise preflop. There are four limpers behind me.

Flop comes out something like J97 rainbow, no flush draw put possibly some kind of gutshot straight. I'll bet that, hoping more than anything to drive the other players out, but three limpers remain. I'm getting worried.

Next card is something trobulesome; say for example an 8 or another J. Is it worth betting again on the turn, or should I check-fold?

[RockLobster]

Hi NRS--

Nice post.

Not long after purchasing Poker Tracker, I found that I was losing money with AKo. Something told me that I should be winning $ with this hand, so I did some research.

I found that I was winning near the maximum amount when my hand improved. That's good. BUT I was losing too much when my hand didn't improve.

As a good player who raises PF, it's not unusual for people to put you on AK or AQ. When the flop misses, your flop bet may not get a lot of respect. If there are 1 or 2 opponents, betting the flop is pretty much automatic. And depending on the opponent, betting the turn and river on an uncoordinated board may also be in order.

But when faced with 3+ opponents, betting the flop is more questionable. If 3+ are still around on the turn, betting is usually a waste of money (in the example you gave... when your AK doesn't improve).

I hope this helps...

[Tosh]

I assume you raise with this hand so the pot is likely laying you odds to call a bet looking for an ace or a king. Betting is better than calling here IMO and I will normally come out and bet. If a lot of opponents are still around on the turn you will need to have made something to bet. You can semi bluff the turn against 3 or less opponents as long as they are able to fold a hand thats not very strong but still better than yours, e.g. bottom pair.

One thing to be mindful is when you hit an ace and get raised. Your hand will often be good but remember people like to play any ace so when you hit TPTK they may have made 2 pair.

[HUSKER'66]

AKo with four callers and no help on the flop....not much fun, eh? Depending on how long you have been playing this table and what kind of grasp you have on the other players moves dictates a lot IMHO. With your preflop raise and betting on the flop, you have only been able to lose one other player. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]With your example of a J97 rainbow flop, I wouldn't be so sure that one of the other players hasn't hit the flop in some way. At 1/2 online some players have been known to play 8/10o for a raise and other "unlikely" hands. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]Call me weak tight [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]but I would check fold on this hand. Your out of position, have six outs aginst three unknown players, and there is a possible straight or trips on the board. Muck and save your money for another hand.

[NRS]

Thanks for the advice, guys. Actually, I'm quite certain that check-folding the turn would be the right EV play in this situation; in fact it's plenty likely that I'm drawing dead.

But this does get into the question of table image a little bit. I'll generally play fewer hands than the other players at a table like this (probably 30%), but those that I do play, I'll be more aggressive with. While there's no shame in the raise-fold pattern, I figure it might be mistaken for weakness and could reduce my ability to extract bets on the turn/river when my hand does improve.

Perhaps I need to be more sensitive w/r/t table position. The unwillingness of many players to reraise makes it difficult to get good reads when I'm leading the betting, which I find I frequently am in these games.

[HUSKER'66]

[ QUOTE ]
....it might be mistaken for weakness and could reduce my ability to extract bets.....

[/ QUOTE ]

Utilize the check raise early in the game if possible. This will help on later hands when your wanting a free card cheaply. If you are in early position and have a tendency to be aggressive (as you say that you are) this is a great move if you feel confident of someone betting behind you, especially when you have the lead in the hand. On later hands when you check, you will "freeze" the others left to act; especially if they missed the flop as well. IMO this is a valuable tool (being able to change speeds so to speak) and keeps your opponents guessing. They won't see your "check" as weakness, and they will probably not bluff at the pot for fear of being called.

[47outs]

"there are 4 limpers", no there isnt, they are called.. "cold callers". Bad Flop, Save your money, fight another battle.