A4o (4handed)

oreogod · #1 11-22-2005, 03:18 PM

Definitley not the best hand I have played (but this is lower stakes than Im used to, playing with a friend...so I know the flop bet is bleh. And the turn raise is sorta bleh to). Anyway, not much of a read. I know hes not a good player, maybe decent or bad...this is like 10 hands in.

Pokerstars. (4handed)
Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
Hero raises, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, Button folds, SB folds, BB raises, Hero calls.

Turn: (6 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero raises, BB 3-bets, Hero...

Plan.

(Im probably calling this mess and folding river UI...Im dead to a set but 8 outs to two pair as Im pretty sure my ace is clean)

spydog · #2 11-22-2005, 03:20 PM

Preflop: I usually fold, but let's not get in a huge discussion.

Flop: You missed with 3 opponents. I generally check-fold.

Turn: I don't like raising here. You likely blow him off 6x or 5x, and sometimes even Kx. Just call and plan on raising the river.

aba20 · #3 11-22-2005, 04:28 PM

Preflop is good. Flop isn't too bad since Kxx are always good bluffing boards, but you are against three opponenets so it is real close. I disagree that your A outs aren't tainted. I could see you being up against A6/A5 that seems more likely to me than K5/K6/56. I probably fold the turn without much of a read.

waffle · #4 11-22-2005, 04:39 PM

I like how you played this up to the flop bet. I like the bet but I fold immediately on the flop to the check raise. Even if he's check raising bottom pair you are peeling to only 3 outs.

edit: pokerstars cards.. yeah yeah i know

aba20 · #5 11-22-2005, 04:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I like the bet but I fold immediately on the flop to the check raise. Even if he's check raising bottom pair you are peeling to only 3 outs.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is a very good point.

oreogod · #6 11-22-2005, 09:41 PM

Okay so lets change this to how I would usually play it if I was at my regular limit. Give me your river plan.

Pokerstars. (4handed)
Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
Hero raises, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, Button folds, SB folds, BB raises, Hero calls.

Okay here, I know a bet with three others in could be a little marginal, but the K is a decent card to take a stab at. So lets say I bet. I get check-raised by BB. 11sbs in the pot. If Im against just top pair or mid pair I could have 3 outs ~14:1 to hit. All I need to make up is 1.5bbs. Unfortunatly against two pair or better I either need two perfects or Im a gonner. Pile on the fact that we also have to think about is his position (if hes paying attention to it, that is)..unless he changed his mind when the others folded, his intention it seems, was to CR the field, in which case I could be dead as is. And its very possible a fold is the best move. But say I peel.

Turn: (6 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls.

Self explantitory. I am either ahead or still behind, if behind Im drawing live to a better two pair (unless of course hes got the better ace).

River: (8 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero.......

Call or raise? And if u raise are u calling a 3bet?

TStoneMBD · #7 11-22-2005, 09:46 PM

in a real game dont call the checkraise on the flop.

dont call the turn 3bet in that game. if you think the decision is really close then calling is better as you said.

in a real game raising the river instead of the turn makes no sense. often times villain will checkcall the river whereas his bet on the turn will often lead to him calling for his 5 outter and commiting himself to showdown after the river hits.

i think call/call is fine in alot of spots. alot of players go into checkcall mode when the ace hits and a bet into an ace often means hes hoping you raise.