US Crime Rate!

Previous posts have referred to the high US crime rate. I don’t really know where we stand in comparison to other countries but the following are some of my thoughts:


1.Crime rates involve underreporting, due to victims not reporting and due to reporting manipulation. As to both aspects, I think our system reporting is more honest and likely more true. I would trust some other nation’s data far less.

2. Our police system is less corrupt and far less likely to “look the other way” for a price, influence, power, or other reasons. In some countries people would not even dream of calling the police. In contrast to #1 above, this aspect may significantly effect underreporting, but not due to manipulation or control of reporting, just outright selectively dealing with crime. This aspect may greatly increase underreporting. This degree is the US is far less, IMO .


I also hold the view that much the same can be said for our prison population. To the extent that we are high on that factor too, it is also for many of the same reasons. However, since I strongly feel that drugs should be legal, if not for that one very grave factor, our prison population would be far lower.


IMO

totally agree, although i think what you say is probably true for english speaking countries and places like germany, switzerland, denmark, etc.


the culture is just one that is totally different from even, say, france or italy (read somewhere somebody was saying they had to go down and give the telephone company guy a bribe to get his phone service turned on in france or italy or somewhere. this may have been some time ago, though. wow.)


also note that when your talking about certain issues a lot of time youre comparing the same country with itself over time.


also things like homicide statistics tend to be cut and dried (at least in first world countries).


brad

Having drugs illegal certainly creates high costs. But in many different settings throughout history, societies have moved in the direction of making drugs illegal. So they must have been experiencing even higher costs with legal drugs.


My own suspicion is that people's hearts just aren't hard enough to stomach a legal-drug population withering in the streets.


eLROY

I think we may be saying the same thing.


Legalizing drugs will still mean that there will be a cost to society in programs, etc. However, the reduction in crime and the harm done through those crimes will more than offset any other costs related to legalizing drugs. (not ot mention reduced costs of law enforcement, prisons, impact on families)


Also, I feel that there will be less people getting involved in drugs, because drug dealers "push" there products. No reason to do so anymore.


Out society is not yet there, but 'there' is where we have to go/

well, who is going to work in wackenhut prisons is drugs are legal?


brad

A very good display of English skills, brad.

well, who is going to work in wackenhut prisons if drugs are legal?


brad

"there will be a cost to society in programs, etc."


Locking them up works every time. I have not seen a whole lot of evidence that "programs" do much good. And not only are programs a joke, but the question of costs is not so much their size, but who bears them. I would prefer the biggest burden be put on those using the drugs. That way, it discourages the problem - feedback


You might say that, when the costs are spread around society, that the natural response of society is to make drugs illegal, to prevent the user from using all he wants. Then, when the costs are targeted at the user, the natural response is to use less.


"the reduction in crime and the harm done through those crimes"


Are you talking about a reduction in crime simply by reducing the number of things which are called crimes? Or are you saying that drug addicts commit more crime when they are in prison?


"not ot mention reduced costs of law enforcement, prisons, impact on families"


If you have ever lived around serious addicts, you will know that the impact on their families is much mitigated when they are finally locked up. At the same time as their life expectancy rises drastically. Do you have any idea the true cost of having an uncontrollable, self-destructing addict in your family or community?


If you are just talking about the high-rolling families of drug dealers, screw'em.


Finally, I am confused as to why you would venture a wild guess that the cost of legal drugs would be lower, when the actual experience of societies throughout history would suggest otherwise.


eLROY

'Finally, I am confused as to why you would venture a wild guess that the cost of legal drugs would be lower, when the actual experience of societies throughout history would suggest otherwise. '


restricting the argument to heroin addicts, programs in holland and england prove you wrong.


on a tangent, dr. dean edell (used to listen to every day) makes the valid point that substantial morphine users can lead a perfectly normal life (talking about chronic pain associated with very serious diseases).


brad