TT first hand at new table vs brown trouter

ZootMurph · #1 11-15-2005, 01:58 PM

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: ZootMurph is MP3 with T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. ZootMurph posts a blind of $2.
1 fold, UTG+1 :#A500AF(2+2er)/ raises, 3 folds, ZootMurph (poster) calls, 3 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB bets, 2+2er calls, ZootMurph calls.

Turn: (4.75 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, 2+2er bets, ZootMurph calls, BB folds.

River: (6.75 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
2+2er bets, ZootMurph calls.

Final Pot: 8.75 BB

I just wanted to go through my thought process here and see what everyone else thinks.

Preflop, I post with TT. A raise from a 2+2er from EP, so I just call. I figure I can fold when he bets and an overcard comes. I've played with BB before, who plays will call with just about anything in that spot, and he likes to lead off the betting on the flop often, so his flop bet means nothing to me. I also believe 2+2er knows this.

However, 2+2er's call means he may have missed the flop, so my hand has a pretty good chance of being good here. I figure if an overcard doesn't turn, I'll raise on the turn.

The turn spade puts three spades on board, and BB checks. I'm sure he's now done with the hand. However, 2+2er bets. My read here is that he did hit the flop, probably AQ or KQ, with no spades, and he wants to end the hand here. Because of the quickness of the bet, I'm guessing he would have raised BB if he'd bet. I now believe my flush draw is good plus a T will win it for me. I have 11 outs and getting 5.75:1 on my money. I call. BB folds as expected.

River gives me the flush. 2+2er bets. I consider a raise, but if my read is wrong and he has me beat, he'll three bet me, if he doesn't, he'll fold and I won't get any information on his hand, so I just call.

Normally, I'd 3 bet preflop with 1-s, but since I'd posted I felt a call was better. This was probably the first of SEVERAL mistakes in this hand. Please comment.

damaniac · #2 11-15-2005, 02:09 PM

I don't really love the preflop. If the BB will call with anything best to charge him two bets now. Further, I think your equity edge against an open raise increases if you make it more likely you can get TAG to fold earlier in the hand (ie, the fewer cards he sees the lower the chance he pairs up and beats you if he has two overs). I don't know, but I suspect three-betting and then betting most flops will get him to drop overs (AQ on a K high board, for ex).

Regardless of whether that is correct or not, I don't get the reasoning on the flop. I don't see a TAG calling because he missed. I think he either hit really hard (flush draw, trips, boat, maybe TP) and doesn't want to lose customers. I don't see why he'd just call with an aggressive player still to act behind him, if he has a marginal hand I think he has to drop it or raise and hope to get you to drop. Doesn't mean he can't have a weak hand but I don't see a good TAG playing it like that often. I think the line is fine however.

Turn, seems to make sense. I don't know how sure you can reasonably be of the things you are assuming, but whatever. Regardless of what BB has, I'm not worried about pushing him out now that I think I'm drawing, so I think calling is fine. I'd consider raising though since TAG can be betting a lot of hands that might be behind you, but then I also don't want to get three-bet.

River is fine, but I wouldn't worry about "getting information" on his hand. You're taking that line b/c it maximizes your expectation, the fear of him folding worse hands and raising better ones is why you don't raise, not not getting to see his hand.