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Old 06-19-2003, 02:22 AM
Chris Alger Chris Alger is offline
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Default Liberating Iraq, Part II: The Right to Vote

From today's NY Times:

"[L]ast week, L. Paul Bremer III, the head of the American military occupation in Iraq, unilaterally canceled what American officials here said would have been the first such election in Iraq since the fall of Saddam Hussein. Overruling the local American military commander, Mr. Bremer decreed that conditions in Najaf were not appropriate for an election. Several days later, American marines stormed the offices of an obscure local political party here, arrested four members and jailed them for four days. The offense, the Americans said, was a violation of a new edict by Mr. Bremer that makes it illegal to incite violence against forces occupying Iraq. ... American officials have said it may take up to two years for an elected Iraqi government to take over the country"

The article points out that the expected winner of the cancelled election was a Shiite dissident who spent six years in Iraqi prison before fleeing the country and has pledged, in contrast to the Iranian system of theocratic veto, to democratize Iraq.

In other words, the US dictator of Iraq is actively suppressing democratic processes that produces "inappropriate" results and criminalizing those political parties that the US opposes. Presumably, the reason elections will be put off for up to two years instead of two months is that the US requires this time to hand-pick its own guy and destroy his political competitors. (Or perhaps there will two parties the US favors, the Iraqi People's Party and the People's Party of Iraq, one of which will pledge to first stimulate foreign investment and then privatize public resources and another that wishes to reverse the order).

The article also points out that 1,000 Iraqis demonstrated against the election cancellation, a act of real courage, in light of the Human Rights Watch findings of excessive force by US troops when they shot more than hundred demonstrators last April in Falluja, killing 20.

It is, of course, illegal in the US to criminalize a political party for mere "incitement" to violence (it requires a showing of imminence), but since Democracy = Tryanny, such technicalities are likely to be overlooked by the mainstream press (as it was overlooked by the writer of the Times article).
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Old 06-19-2003, 08:02 AM
nicky g nicky g is offline
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Default Re: Liberating Iraq, Part II: The Right to Vote

Hi Chris,

Article on the state of the media under Bremer which you might find interesting.

Iraq: US military & free speech

Excerpt: "What kind of message did the US military send to the Iraqis when it seized "editorial control" of Mosul city's only TV station because of its "predominantly non-factual/unbalanced news coverage" - meaning the re-broadcasting of Qatari Arab satellite network al-Jazeera?

"We have every right as an occupying power to stop the broadcast of something that will incite violence," Major General David Petraeus told reporters after being alerted to the offending broadcasts. "Yes, what we are looking at is censorship but you can censor something that is intended to inflame passions."

According to a Wall Street Journal report, a US army major was relieved of her duties and removed from the base when she argued that the order contravened principles of free speech. After all, these are principles guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States, which every US soldier must "solemnly swear" to "support and defend".

But these contradictions fly everywhere. Having invested $20 million dollars over three months in the rebuilding of Iraqi state TV & radio, renamed the Iraqi Media Network (IMN), the US officials in charge of the contract began balking at the new network's news output immediately it went on air.

Managers were told to drop the readings from the Koran, the 'vox-pop' man-in-the-street interviews (usually critical of the US invasion) and even to run their content past the wife of a US-friendly Iraqi Kurdish leader for a pre-broadcast check. The station rejected the demands and dug in their heels. "As journalists we will not submit to censorship," Dan North, a Canadian documentary maker training Iraqis at the station, told Reuters."
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Old 06-19-2003, 10:31 AM
Jimbo Jimbo is offline
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Default Re: Liberating Iraq, Part II: The Right to Vote

See what happens when you fight a war and lose? Them's the breaks boys! Better luck next time. Iran, are you listening?


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Old 06-19-2003, 10:47 AM
John Cole John Cole is offline
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Default Re: Liberating Iraq, Part II: The Right to Vote

Jimbo,

You must use the words "fight," "war," and "lose" in ways with which I am unfamiliar.

John

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Old 06-19-2003, 11:46 AM
Jimbo Jimbo is offline
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Default Re: Liberating Iraq, Part II: The Right to Vote

Hi John,

I left my secret decoder ring at the Cracker Jacks store. [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Would you mind elaborating a bit more on your post?

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  #6  
Old 06-19-2003, 03:05 PM
John Cole John Cole is offline
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Default Re: Liberating Iraq, Part II: The Right to Vote

Jimbo,

You mean you lost your Ring?

If I walk past Mike Tyson, and he hits me square on the jaw, I crumple. I wouldn't expect anyone to say that if I decide to "fight" Mike Tyson then I'm bound to "lose." But, if it's framed in those terms, it would seem I've made a rather unwise decision.

John
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Old 06-19-2003, 07:23 PM
Cyrus Cyrus is offline
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Default Breaker

"See what happens when you fight a war and lose? Them's the breaks boys!"

If the Iraqis instead of "fighting a war" had chosen to surrender, can you explain what would have turned out differently as to the post-invasion situation? We would have had the same chaotic situtation policed inadequately by Americal soldiers ignorant of customs, language or context and we would've had the same reluctance by Washington to hand over democracy to the natives.
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Old 06-20-2003, 12:13 AM
MMMMMM MMMMMM is offline
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Default Re: Liberating Iraq, Part II: The Right to Vote

Saddam had 17(?!) chances to cooperate with U.N. Resolutions regarding proscribed weapons. Seems he made 17 unwise decisions and then managed to top it all off at the end.

Now, entirely hypothetically: if you had been ordered by a court to retract certain printed statements about Mr. Tyson, and not to make further statements about him, yet you persisted 17 times against the judges' rulings; and if you also had an agreement with him personally, in writing, which you also flouted;-); and then finally you walked past Iron Mike and stuck out your tongue and farted in his general direction, and he hit you in the jaw--well, I'd say he just might have a point;-)
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Old 06-20-2003, 12:18 AM
andyfox andyfox is offline
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Default Re: Liberating Iraq, Part II: The Right to Vote

I think your summation is a perfect description of the Bush Doctrine: Them's the breaks boys, better luck next time.

Note that the administration has now told Iran it will not stand for them developing a nuclear weapon. We'll make the rules, boys, better luck next time.

When the blowback from all this hubris comes and makes 9-11 look like a girl scout picnic, what will our leaders tell us? Them's the breaks, boys, better luck next time?
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  #10  
Old 06-20-2003, 12:24 AM
andyfox andyfox is offline
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Default Re: Liberating Iraq, Part II: The Right to Vote

I agree with you 100%. Our invasion of Iraq made exactly the same sense as would Mike Tyson striking John Cole because John passed gas in his general direction. In fact, the logic of our foreign policy seems to have been concocted by Mr. Tyson. Thanks for the wonderful analogy.
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