Flopping the joint but then what? (i only flopped a pair)

[Tyler Durden]

I didn't flop the joint in this hand but I like that term.

6-12 home game. I limp in EP with QJs. Two to my left, a player raises. I've played with this guy many times, he's a 2+2er and he usually has a strong hand when he raises. Folded back to me and I call.

Flop comes Q-9-x. I bet b/c I like betting into the PFR, and also b/c I want to win the hand. He raises and I call.

The turn is a Jack. I check, he bets, I raise, he 3-bets and I call.

The river is a brick. I check and he thinks and thinks and says "i'm going to save you twelve bucks" and flips over aces. I drag the pot.

Did I play the flop badly? Would anyone checkraise the flop? Why? Or, if you play it like I do, would you 3-bet the flop to avoid giving a free turn card and to get back in the driver's seat? I thought I played this hand well but after a discussion with another 2+2er I've been thinking about it and maybe I didn't.


Thanks for any input.

[J.R.]

I prefer betting the flop in this situation. I would have called the flop raise.

Whether to lead or check-raise the turn should depend on whether this player will pound overcards or be likely to take a free card, in addition to your present read on him. I would have bet the turn and hoped to 3-bet.

Why didn't you cap the turn (assuming a 4 bet cap)?

[Tyler Durden]

We were heads-up so there was no cap. I didn't 4-bet the turn b/c I thought I was behind when he 3-bet after I checkraised. That's showing a lot of strength on his part. Although the only hands that beat me are KT, QQ, and JJ. I guess I should have known I was still in the lead b/c he's not going to raise preflop with KT and he wouldn't have played the flop in that manner with JJ. And there's only one combo for QQ. Well I guess 99 beats me as well.

Hmmmm....

[Bob T.]

Was this hand played headsup? It seemed like it from you description, but it wasn't completely clear to me.


On the flop, if he had AK, how would he play if you bet into him, or if you checkraised him, or three bet him. Or for that matter with AQ or pocket tens, would he play the same. I don't think that you can get much information on the flop. But you could get set up to give a free card on the turn. I think that either checkraising, or three betting is more likely to get you the initiative on the turn. Then on the turn, you bet, he raises, and now you can three bet. I think he calls. Then you can bet the river.

If you don't improve on the turn, you bet, and then he raises, you can call, and probably call on the river.

By being more aggressive on the flop, and getting the initiative to act first on the turn, you might win one more bet when you are ahead, then you would lose when you are behind. Because you would either not give the free card on the turn, or be able to three bet the turn when you improve.