Aggression question

[DRKEVDC]

I am having a hard time with a certain concept. Lets say that I flop a straight, that at the time is the nuts, I make a bet, get raised and I come over the top of him/her. At this point I am usually all in. If they call and make a boat/flush is that Omaha or am I being too aggressive with more cards to come.

What if this same scenario happens on the turn, do you push with one more card to come and if the person hits their flush/boat to beat your straight you take it on the chin?

[autobet]

On the flop you need to be more cautious than the turn, but when the money is not deep (and it usually isn't on the Internet) and you can reraise all in, then I recommend you usually push and hope for the best. If the money is deep, you can call, take a look at the turn and go from there.

On the turn you will almost always be the favorite (except when they are freerolling), so pushing is usually correct with only one card to come. Sometimes just call and bet a scarry river card (ie board pairing) trying to blow them off a hand you are probably/possibly splitting with.

[PorscheNGuns]

A made straight on the flop is a ~65-35 favorite over both a set on the flop OR a flush draw on the flop. If the turn does not pair, you become a 75-25 favorite to win with one card left to come. Against *both you are a 40-60 dog.

If you have the nut straight on the flop and can get all in against one opponent, do it every time.

-Matt

[Acesover8s]

[ QUOTE ]

If you have the nut straight on the flop and can get all in against one opponent, do it every time.

-Matt

[/ QUOTE ]

Terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible!

Flop is T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] And you have A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

And your opponent is willing to commit his 200x BB stack against you? No thanks.

[beset7]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

If you have the nut straight on the flop and can get all in against one opponent, do it every time.

-Matt

[/ QUOTE ]

Terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible!

Flop is T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] And you have A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

And your opponent is willing to commit his 200x BB stack against you? No thanks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Also known as "fear the freeroll when stacks are deep." I had it on a post it on the side of my screen for awhile...

edit: any math-heads want to figure out how often, and to what size bet, with 200xBB stacks, someone would have to be freerolling the nut FD with the same flopped nut straight as you to make folding the nuts on the flop the right play? I think its suprising low if the stacks are deep enough and you have to commit most of it.

[Acesover8s]

As an obvious sidenote, notice that AKJJ and AKQJ type hands also have a freeroll over your hand, even without the flushdraw.

Russ Georgiev once said that the biggest money losing hand in PLO is the flopped broadway straight.

[DRKEVDC]

So is the consensus call the raise on the flop and evaluate from there?

[PorscheNGuns]

I should qualify my advice as 100PLO and under, since given your example, you are coming out way ahead in the long run by going all in there. I've encountered countless players who would absolutely throw in their whole 100xBB stack on even K9 there, or a non-nut flush draw.

-Matt

[benkahuna]

You have to beware of freerolls (when you have an identical hand to someone else and they're freerolling an outdraw) and being against so many other draws that you are no longer the favorite. Imagine there are numerous draws against you. 2 flush board, you have nut str8 not broadway where someone could draw to a higher str8, lots of action, you're usually supposed to fold or at least not reraise.

I agree flopped nut straights are much less dangerous without facing deep stacks and/or multiple opponents. All the advice here is very good.

[DRKEVDC]

Is it safe to say that straights on the flop and turn with draws out there are marginally +EV or maybe even 0?