Building a monstrous pot w/ QQ - overplayed hand?

Ulysses · #1 04-13-2003, 05:26 AM

Ramming, jamming, crazy 15-30 game.

Super-loose gambling MP limper. Super-aggressive-maniac raises in CO. Aggressive, decent-playing button 3-bets. I find Q [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img] Q [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img] in the SB and 4-bet. MP limper calls. CO caps at 5 bets. Button, I, and limper call. I don't have any reason to believe button has a big hand - he'd definitely 3-bet to isolate CO w/ any playable hand.

Flop 5 [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img] J [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img] T [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img]

I bet. MP folds. CO raises. Button 3-bets. I 4-bet. CO calls. Button calls.

I can't put CO on any kind of hand. She'll pump any draw, any pair. Clubs, QK, AT, AJ, any big pocket pair are among the possible hands. Button I now suspect has a real hand - perhaps has me beat w/ TT/JJ/KK/AA.

Turn Q [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] (5 [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img] J [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img] T [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img])

OK. I think I'm in the lead now. I bet. CO raises. I consider that she could have AK (clubs?) but she'd still raise w/ any set, any two pair, and any big pair. Button considers for a while, then cold-calls. I 3-bet. CO calls. Button calls.

River J [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] (Q [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] 5 [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img] J [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img] T [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img])

I like it. I think I would have heard more from a set of Jacks. I bet. Both players call.

After the hand, players commented that they felt I overplayed my hand on the flop and turn. Do you agree?

PokerPrince · #2 04-13-2003, 05:40 AM

The players that thought you overplayed your hand were morons. You played it wonderfully. Exactly how I would have done it if I were blessed with such an opportunity.

PokerPrince

Ulysses · #3 04-13-2003, 06:09 AM

CO showed 8 [img]/forums/images/icons/diamond.gif[/img] 9 [img]/forums/images/icons/diamond.gif[/img] for the turned bottom straight.
Button, a friend of mine, told me he had KK.

So, apparently I was in second place at every step until the river.

gavrilo · #4 04-13-2003, 06:21 AM

Well, only place I might have slowed down a bit is on the turn, someone could have had a straight here and someone did, although you still have outs for your fullhouse/quads, on this particular hand because of the board, I wouldn't be in there slinging chips around. That's me though.

astroglide · #5 04-13-2003, 01:32 PM

oops: edit

astroglide · #6 04-13-2003, 01:34 PM

i wouldn't say it was an overplay necessarily given the context of the game. i've run into weird situations all the time - admittably online - where it's 3 bets to me, i cap it, and bet the whole way with jj as an overpair (with a ten on the board), everybody calls, and everybody loses. just the same it does seem like there's a whole lot that can beat you. 4betting the turn seems fine since you've got so many opponents and your boat would likely be best, but i would expect to be losing on the turn.

Diplomat · #7 04-13-2003, 02:45 PM

I like it, I like it. I'd worry on the turn, but I'd three-bet anyway. If you get four-bet, you know what to look for on the river. [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

I'm surprized the button called your river bet with KK, but I guess it's not unreasonable.

-Diplomat

Ulysses · #8 04-13-2003, 03:36 PM

It's very tough to slow down on the turn.

It's almost impossible for button to have a better hand than me here. The only possible straight he could have based on the flop play is AcKc. If he made that on the turn, I think he'd 3-bet and hope I have a big hand rather than just call CO's raise.

On the other hand, it's definitely possible that CO has a straight, but it's also possible that she has just about anything. Because of that, I felt like I had to 3-bet and take my chances. I can't believe she didn't re-raise, but she told me she was 100% sure I had AK on the turn.

elysium · #9 04-13-2003, 03:38 PM

hi ulysses
played masterfully; a work of art.

gavrilo · #10 04-13-2003, 03:48 PM

I guess for me it would depend on what I read the other players for. I don't think that raising on the turn is necessarily a bad move, I just wouldn't do if I thought someone had a straight because there is probably no chance of them folding here or on the river if you don't hit, So you are building a pot with one card to come that you need to hit to win.
I don't know, maybe the math would justify raising, that's my opinion though.