99 vs 2+2er

tiltaholic · #1 07-07-2005, 09:38 AM

UTG+1 is so far a solid TAG. I'm pretty sure he's a 2+2er as well.

I thought I'd was only confused on the turn, but in retrospect I think I may have misplayed the flop and river too. Any thoughts?

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, 4 folds, Button calls, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (4 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero bets, BB folds, UTG+1 calls, Button calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 raises, Button folds, Hero 3-bets, UTG+1 caps, Hero calls.

River: (11.50 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 calls.

Final Pot: 13.50 BB

Dave G. · #2 07-07-2005, 09:45 AM

I think the flop bet is fine. You can't be sure anyone will bet and you don't want to give a free card to any overcards to your 9s or any long shot draws.

I think I just call the turn raise and check/call the river. It looks like he either hit his set on the turn or was slowplaying it from the flop. The river is too scary for him to raise with 4 to a straight and 3 to a flush.

The way you played it I'd check/call the river to try and induce a bluff (but he might still have you beaten here anyway, so meh).

@bsolute_luck · #3 07-07-2005, 09:46 AM

definitely appears to be 88. call his raise on the turn once it's HU. with the 3rd [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] falling and 4 to a straight, i'd probably lead out the river doubting he'd reraise with his trips, but may fold. the way you played it i think is spewing and the pot is too big on the river.

my thoughts anyways [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

anybody raise preflop?

Redd · #4 07-07-2005, 09:57 AM

I usually raise this from the blinds with any number of limpers.

I think the turn 3-bet is fine, since this guy could have A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] or something and be semibluffing a free showdown. The river was a bet-fold, I presume? Depending on how strongly you trust your read, I might even find a check-fold on the river; what turn capping hands are you ahead of at this point? Is this A8 >1 time in 12?

imported_The Vibesman · #5 07-07-2005, 09:57 AM

A lot of times I'll raise this pre-flop, but I don't think it makes much of a difference.

I play the flop the same, I don't want anyone drawing for free.

Not sure about the three-bet on the turn, if your read is correct then UTG+1 probably didn't limp in with A8 or K8, he may have limped in early with a pocket pair like 88, or slowplayed a flopped set.

After the cap on the turn I would just check-call the river. I am no longer confident we have the best hand and I don't think he's going to fold a better hand than ours in fear of a backdoor flush or str8. I don't want to be raised if he does have the flush. I can't fold for one bet on the river here, tho.

bozlax · #6 07-07-2005, 09:58 AM

What about preflop? No raise to try and scare away BB?

Flop: You're either betting out or likely letting it check through. Do you think UTG+1 would bet out with overcards?

Turn: I think his raise scares me into calldown mode. Is a TAG going to play 87s or a club draw like this?

River: The way you played it, after he caps the turn I check-call. You've still got top pair, but there are 3 to a flush and a couple of straights (unlikely) on the board, and I'm not convinced you're going to be best if called, and REALLY don't want to be raised. What's your plan if raised?

I guess re-reading my response it smacks of weak-tight (except preflop?), but I'm not comfortable playing a middle pair as hard as you did when you hit as much resistance as you did on the turn.

tiltaholic · #7 07-07-2005, 10:00 AM

[ QUOTE ]
definitely appears to be 88. call his raise on the turn once it's HU. with the 3rd [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] falling and 4 to a straight, i'd probably lead out the river doubting he'd reraise with his trips, but may fold. the way you played it i think is spewing and the pot is too big on the river.

my thoughts anyways [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

anybody raise preflop?

[/ QUOTE ]

i think he'd raise 88 pf at this table, but you wouldn't know that since you weren't at the table [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

yeah...i'm unsure about the lack of pf raise as well.

regarding the turn: once it did get HU, that was kind of why i did 3-bet it. i figured his raise could mean lots of things. however, he capped. so following my reasoning, i probably should have check called the river...doh.

DeathDonkey · #8 07-07-2005, 10:12 AM

Fold to the turn raise. Barring that, fold to the turn cap. Dude there is no way he doesn't have a set if he is any good. If he showed you less than a set he isn't any good and disregard this.

-DeathDonkey

tiltaholic · #9 07-07-2005, 10:13 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Fold to the turn raise. Barring that, fold to the turn cap. Dude there is no way he doesn't have a set if he is any good. If he showed you less than a set he isn't any good and disregard this.

-DeathDonkey

[/ QUOTE ]

where were you when i needed you last night [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

TomBrooks · #10 07-07-2005, 04:02 PM

Hey tilt,

PREFLOP: Why no raise here? SSH says raise 99 from the SB. I'd like to knock out BB and get this down to 3-way with a vulnerable pair like 99.

FLOP: Betting looks good to me.

TURN: I like the bet, but not the 3 bet. UTG's raise seems to indicate he made a set of Eights or of one of the flop cards that he was slowplaying. I don't think he played 75 for a straight if he's a TAG. I don't see two pair on this low board coming from a TAG either, and he wouldn't be value betting a flush draw if he knows what he's doing.

RIVER: UTG not only raised you on the turn, he capped it. Why are you betting into him on the river? (see Edit below.) I think the only reason he is not raising you here with a better hand is because your bet makes you look like you made a flush, a straight or a straight flush. I'd be surprised if you won this hand.

EDIT After Reading thread: I think your beat, but on the River you probably want to see a showdown with your overpair, so I like what @bsolute suggested. Bet into the River and you might steal the pot if this TAG is capable of "laying down a big hand." He will likely not raise you with the river card that puts straights and flushes on the board, so you'll be able to see the showdown for one bet anyway. If he raises, there is no need to call.