misunderstood theory....

[Riverboat Cap'n]

This hasn't happened, but it is a source of constant confusion for the 'meta-game' for me.
You're on the button, 78s. five callers. Action? I think here I would limp.
Let's now say that the SB raises, all call to you. You are now getting the same pot odds, although risking more money. The SB is representing a very strong hand, but could be limiting the field to strengthen a marginal hand, which is probably still better than yours. I think I call and guess that if the flop hits me, it's missed most everyone else.
Impressions?

[Homer]

There are a number of different topics in this post:

1) Pot odds - On your first call you are getting 6.5:1 pot odds (5 callers, big blind, small blind = 6.5 small bets), and on your second call you are getting 15:1 pot odds (7 players in for 2 small bets each and your first bet in = 15 small bets). You seem to think that the pot odds you are getting on the first and second calls are identical, but they are not. You need to remember that the first bet put into the pot is no longer anything but part of the pot. It shouldn't be thought of as a seperate bet when considering the call of a subsequent bet. It was merely an initial investment that is now a sunken cost used so that you could continue in the hand.

2) SB's raise - SB's raise indicates that he has a strong hand, not a marginal one that he is trying to protect. He is not expecting anyone to fold to his raise (except maybe the big blind), because all other players have already put one bet in, so they will gladly put in one more to see the flop.

3) Flop hitting you - Why do you assume that if the flop hits you it is unlikely to have hit anyone else? Do you think that everything else has big cards or something like that? Say the flop comes 8h7h2c. You have two-pair, but someone else could easily have 22 for a set, while another player could have 9T for a straight draw, while yet another could have Ah4h for a nut-flush draw.

-- Homer

[Riverboat Cap'n]

You're right about the drawing hands, I hadn't really stopped to think about that, my real question is about the pots odds, which I really have a poor understanding of (as evidenced by by college math grades [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] ) Thanks for your reply, tho..

[Homer]

If you have specific questions concerning pot odds post them on this thread and I will answer them.

-- Homer

[Riverboat Cap'n]

Hhhmm... One of my major problems is that I have such a poor grasp on them that I find it difficult to ask questions without using examples.
I understand the idea of pot odds, although have a difficult time calculating them with ten people at the table staring at me, and I understand the odds of outs.. what confuses me is how to integrate odds and game feel. I've been in the situation where, looking across the table, I've *known* that my high card is good. showndown, and people stare at me in amazement. I've also left a pot with trips on the turn *knowing* that guy beat me.. he showed higher trips.... Perhaps my question is more about strengths.. I've always considered my psychological edge a handicap because I can't really claculate odds, and therefore have a real weakness to new players and a very strong weakness online. Lately I've been playing (and losing) at low limits and trying to work the math without relying too heavily upon psych.
The point is this: Is one very strong edge actually a hindrance to someones overall game.. and what is the best way of fixing any problems in ones game?