KK turn decision on a coordinated board

topspin · #1 06-07-2005, 12:36 AM

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, 1 fold, MP1 calls, 1 fold, MP3 calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, 1 fold, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (9 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (6.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero bets...

Standard? Unless everyone is calling with something worse than second pair with no flush draws on the flop, I'm likely behind to at least one of the players. Checking the turn makes the rest of the hand tougher to play though.

Jakesta · #2 06-07-2005, 12:40 AM

Don't forget about all the outs you just picked up. You now have outs to a flush and straight.

I like betting here.

Weatherhead03 · #3 06-07-2005, 12:41 AM

Tough situation.. I would still bet the turn though as you now do have more outs considering your gunshot and flush draws now.

topspin · #4 06-07-2005, 12:43 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Don't forget about all the outs you just picked up. You now have outs to a flush and straight.

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't forget, that's one of the reasons I pulled the trigger here. Having all the added outs does mean that I can no longer bet and fold to a raise, though, as I could if the board were 3 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]s instead of [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]s.

Transference · #5 06-07-2005, 01:00 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Tough situation.. I would still bet the turn though as you now do have more outs considering your gunshot and flush draws now.

[/ QUOTE ]

FWIW ill suggest a few reasons for not betting out here.

- you have very little idea how many outs you actually have.
- you are not in a position to fold if its raised behind you
- it is certainly not unlikely that this will be raised behind you.
- It is very doubtfull that a better hand will fold for 1 more bet.
- A stronger draw than yours will not fold for one more bet.
- It is unlikely that you are ahead.

Im not saying a check call is correct but I'm suprised no one has suggested the merits of seeing a river as cheaply as possible.

Bodhi · #6 06-07-2005, 01:40 AM

We have the second best pair and the one-card-nut-flush-draw (always wanted to say that [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]). If it's possible that someone doesn't have an Ace, and it is, then I think there's value to betting the turn.

If you don't improve you can check-call the river to avoid being raised.

Bodhi · #7 06-07-2005, 01:41 AM

...because it's better to bet than call if at all possible.

Jakesta · #8 06-07-2005, 01:44 AM

[ QUOTE ]
...because it's better to bet than call if at all possible.

[/ QUOTE ]

mmbt0ne · #9 06-07-2005, 01:44 AM

<blockquote>En réponse à:<hr />
We have the second best pair and the one-card-nut-flush-draw (always wanted to say that [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]).

[/ QUOTE ]

Look again. A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] owns this board right now.

<blockquote>En réponse à:<hr />
If it's possible that someone doesn't have an Ace, and it is, then I think there's value to betting the turn.

If you don't improve you can check-call the river to avoid being raised.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know, with 3 callers on the flop, I'm checking the turn a LOT there. Like, 100% a lot. Are you worried about a free card?

Bodhi · #10 06-07-2005, 01:46 AM

Woah, I totally read that Ace as a [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] for some reason.

In any case, the K flush is still valuable.