Never try and be nice to the fish (WARNING: Rant)

[NYCNative]

So I'm in a $5 SNG. Some player loses a very early all-in to a set of Jacks and complains about how he just lost with a J in his hand to someone with two Jacks in their hand. I folded crap so I didn't see the play exactly so I checked the hand history expecting to see an epic AJ vs. JJ confrontation. Instead, this is what I saw:[ QUOTE ]
Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (8 handed) converter

BB (t1815)
WhyMeUB (t955)
UTG+1 (t2345)
NYCNative (t1445)
MP2 (t3230)
CO (t2810)
Button (t1120)
SB (t1280)

Preflop: NYCNative is MP1 with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
WhyMeUB calls t30, <font color="#666666">5 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises to t120</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, WhyMeUB calls t90.

Flop: (t270) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">WhyMeUB bets t270</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises to t1080</font>, <font color="#CC3333">WhyMeUB raises to t1350</font>.

Turn: (t2700) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>

River: (t2700) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>

Final Pot: t2700

Results below:
SB has Jh Jd (three of a kind, jacks).
WhyMeUB has Jc 7c (one pair, jacks).
Outcome: SB wins t2700.

[/ QUOTE ]The guy is still chatting and I suggest, very nicely, that he shouldn't have called a 4BB raise with J7. He said he was chasing the flush. I then asked, again very nicely, why he was pushing the way he did post-flop when he only had top pair with a crappy kicker and a draw to a medium flush. I was trying to help someone learn from a mistake, try and be a nice guy.

He immediately says "I don't need your advice." I resisted the urge to say "Um, yes you do" and instead went about trying to ignore him. And he wouldn't shut up.

His wit and wisdom included excuses about how he was just "slumming it" in a $5 SNG, how he's been playing for 20 years and how much money he makes playing poker. I can't C&amp;P UB chat or I would post it all. It would be great for a few laughs. Or tears, whatever.

Then I lost the tournament on this hand:[ QUOTE ]
Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t40 (7 handed) converter

CO (t420)
Button (t2250)
NYCNative (t1750)
BB (t3320)
UTG (t2965)
MP1 (t2065)
MP2 (t2230)

Preflop: NYCNative is SB with 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls t40, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP2 calls t40, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, NYCNative completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t160) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
NYCNative checks, BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets t40</font>, NYCNative calls t40, BB folds, UTG folds.

Turn: (t240) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
NYCNative checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets t240</font>, <font color="#CC3333">NYCNative raises to t960</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 raises to t1200</font>, <font color="#CC3333">NYCNative raises to t1920</font>.

River: (t3360) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>

Final Pot: t3360

Results below:
NYCNative has 4h 8d (two pair, eights and fours).
MP2 has Ac As (three of a kind, aces).
Outcome: MP2 wins t3360.

[/ QUOTE ]And then he started berating me about my horrible play and laughing at me. I trid to explain to him the vast difference between the way I went out and the way he went out and he was still typing about how I was outplayed (Or course, Mr. Pocket Aces played it perfectly, letting the small blind guy with crap limp his way from an 80% dog to an 80% favorite) and how he would crush me in the $20 SNGs.

I finally left, sick of arguring (and sick of annoying those still playing the tournament with the chatter) but it is just so irritating. I saw a shitty play and I simply tried to offer some advice. I love advice like that. Hell, I'm sure that I'll be told I played my hand lousy, and that's fine - you get better when corrected.

And all I got for it was being blasted by a twit who thought top pair, 7 kicker was gold, with a weak flush draw.

Now, who will be the first poster to say "Forget talking to the fish; this is why you don't play $5 SUGs!" [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[cleinen]

Why are you completing with an 84o?

[Freudian]

[ QUOTE ]
The guy is still chatting and I suggest, very nicely, that he shouldn't have called a 4BB raise with J7.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why not, top pair and flush draw is a perfectly fine hand to play here on the flop. Loose preflop but thats how many like to play. Nothing remarkable there.

[ QUOTE ]
He immediately says "I don't need your advice." I resisted the urge to say "Um, yes you do" and instead went about trying to ignore him.

[/ QUOTE ]

It may be hard to accept but he really don't need your advice. And that has zero to do with his playing ability.

[NYCNative]

[ QUOTE ]
Why are you completing with an 84o?

[/ QUOTE ]Because I am putting $20 extra into a $160 pot with three other limpers. Any two cards here against four players is not getting bad pot odds and I'm already in for half of it.

[jwesty5]

If you want to educate people do it here. Rarely if ever do I comment playing SNG's. Play SNG's to win and not to get affirmations from other players for giving quality advice.

[NYCNative]

[ QUOTE ]
Why not, top pair and flush draw is a perfectly fine hand to play here on the flop. Loose preflop but thats how many like to play. Nothing remarkable there.

[/ QUOTE ]My main comments were about his post-flop play. It was abysmal, even if we do give him the loose pre-flop call.

[KingDan]

Generally its the fish who try to educate you. I love the fish berating you for the 'loose' calls when the blinds get high, getting odds for almost any 2.

[NYCNative]

[ QUOTE ]
If you want to educate people do it here. Rarely if ever do I comment playing SNG's. Play SNG's to win and not to get affirmations from other players for giving quality advice.

[/ QUOTE ]I agree 200%. Live and learn. I think I'll just keep chat off from now on. I do have the occassional pleasant banter and good sportsmanship, but I don't think I'll miss it compared to the jerks and sore losers and whiners...

[Big Limpin']

it was not abysmal. in this case, hes a 30/70 dog, but he does not know that. If i flop TP/4flush, and get action, im trying to get all my money in there too. Im not saying i never make mistakes, but im not "abysmal" at this game.
He played fine, but was unlucky to run into a monster.

edit: at the 5+1s, you should have no problem finding a dozen better places to give fish lessons.

[Al P]

His play isn't bad. He's a favorite over pocket aces (no A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]) on that flop.