2 Pair

waynethetrain · #1 03-28-2005, 07:43 PM

No read. Early in session.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. UTG posts a blind of $1.
UTG (poster) checks, 1 fold, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, 1 fold, Hero calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, Hero raises, SB folds, BB folds, UTG calls.

Turn: (5 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets, Hero calls.

River: (7 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 9 BB

btspider · #2 03-28-2005, 07:44 PM

elaborate on your questions..

waynethetrain · #3 03-28-2005, 07:54 PM

I didn't want to elaborate too much because I didn't want to give away too much information about the result.

I didn't raise the turn because my opponent lead out after I had raised the flop. At that point I suspected I was beat by AJ otherwise I couldn't see him betting into me like that. Assuming this was reasonable logic, I still felt compelled to call down even though I thought I was beat.

Should I have raised the turn with 2 pair?

If not, should I have called down even though I thought I was beat?

btspider · #4 03-28-2005, 08:04 PM

folding is out.. the decision should be between calling down the turn or raising the turn and then calling down.

waynethetrain · #5 03-28-2005, 08:05 PM

Thank you. He had AJ. My gut was very strong that I was beat. So I wasn't sure if I was too passive or too loose.

ArturiusX · #6 03-28-2005, 08:15 PM

I'm not sure how you can narrow down a poster to AJ, but thats some super hand reading skills.

There's no way his betting habits point to AJ specificly. AJ raises preflop, and AJ probably 3-bets this (or should). I think you had a lucky guess, you should have popped him on the turn too.

waynethetrain · #7 03-28-2005, 08:23 PM

I don't know that everyone raises UTG with AJ, but I see your point. Most players here would have open raised and some would also have 3 bet the flop. If I was sure, I would not have called down. Maybe I've been suffering through so many bad beats lately I am seeing gremlins everywhere. This time (like most of the other times) they were there.
[img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

wabe · #8 03-28-2005, 11:33 PM

I would've popped him on the turn also. Someone with AK/AQ/AT might call and pop the turn.

deepsquat · #9 03-29-2005, 12:06 AM

If i had AJ i would:

1)Pf raise

2) 3 bet the flop or c/r the turn regardless of the jack. The jack would just be a bonus.

If i were you i would have raised the turn and called down if 3 bet.

GrunchCan · #10 03-29-2005, 12:11 AM

[ QUOTE ]
folding is out.. the decision should be between calling down the turn or raising the turn and then calling down.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, you were yearning for disagreement, here it comes.

I fold the turn.

Becasue there were no real draws on the flop and our Hero (correctly) raised PF, diagraming at least TP, what sorts of hands does UTG stop & go the turn with that we are beating or have reasonable draws against?

The pot is offering expressed odds of 6:1 on the turn, but a much worse 3.5:1 effective odds to see the hand through to the river. The combination of times Hero has the best hand here plus the times he improves on the river can't add up to over 20%. So I fold the turn & wait for a better opportunity/bigger pot.