a terrible fold or not?

jt1 · #1 03-04-2005, 03:55 AM

From earlier post involving 3 hands. No one wants to read a 3 handed post so I'll do them one at a time. SB is brand new. MP is loose passive

PP $3-6

MP limps. Hero in CO with KJo raises. SB calls.

K 4 9 rainbow

checked to Hero who bets. Sb raises. MP calls. Hero raises. SB caps. MP calls

5

SB bets. MP calls. Hero folds

Was this okay, or do I suck?

Before today, I called this down 100% of the time unless facing a rock. Been thinking that perhaps I call down too much.

college_boy · #2 03-04-2005, 06:26 AM

If it were me I would just call down his check raise. This might be a leak for me too though.

jt1 · #3 03-04-2005, 06:35 AM

Calling down the turn lead is my default play; I went away from it because I'm working on improving my folding ability. It's a thin line that I need to learn to thread.

Most likely villian has 2 pair giving you outs, but the times you'll win by improving + the times you're already ahead warrant a call down.

But I do believe that capping the flop is better than just calling down, because of the other guy in, and because most of the time check raiser has a worse King.

college_boy · #4 03-04-2005, 06:45 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Calling down the turn lead is my default play; I went away from it because I'm working on improving my folding ability. It's a thin line that I need to learn to thread.

Most likely villian has 2 pair giving you outs, but the times you'll win by improving + the times you're already ahead warrant a call down.

But I do believe that capping the flop is better than just calling down, because of the other guy in, and because most of the time check raiser has a worse King.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you think you are ahead most of the time then capping is the right play. I was assuming you were ahead part of the time and would improve about 20% of the time by the river. How often would you say you're ahead here?

jt1 · #5 03-04-2005, 06:52 AM

[ QUOTE ]
If you think you are ahead most of the time then capping is the right play. I was assuming you were ahead part of the time and would improve about 20% of the time by the river. How often would you say you're ahead here?

[/ QUOTE ]

1/2 the time, but I just remembered that i didn't cap. he did. i'm ahead a quarter of the time if he cr then caps and leads the turn. that's my first guess - does that make calling down +ev?

college_boy · #6 03-04-2005, 07:07 AM

It's late so I don't know if i counted the bets right but I think your effective odds are 14.5 to 2 for the call down so if you think you're ahead a quarter of the time here plus the times you'll improve I think you have to call down. Do you agree?

einbert · #7 03-04-2005, 07:08 AM

Nice hand. I like the way you played it.

A consideration could be made for not three-betting the flop and raising a safe turn card (folding to a three-bet) but I like your line too. Nice use of the information you gained on the flop.

Grease · #8 03-04-2005, 08:45 AM

Since he was undeterred by your 3-bet PF, and lead out on the turn, I think a fold here is definitely the right play. Nice hand.

bakku · #9 03-04-2005, 08:50 AM

This turn fold is bad, especially against an unknown. You have outs to counterfeit 2 pair. Actually, against an unknown I'm calling the river too.

27offsooot · #10 03-04-2005, 09:30 AM

I would call down. A weaker King, K10, K8, K7 may play this similarly depending on the opponent. W/o a solid read and the MP caller sticking around, I think that you have to call this down.