$200+15 heads up hand

[peanutbutter]

Villain is ComeOnPhish, a fairly solid $200+15 player, more conservative than most. He knows that I'm tight but I doubt that he knows that I know that he knows that I'm tight. However, about 5 hands earlier (T5500) I lost with Q6o vs. his AJo, which prolly made him loosen up a bit.

(Converter is screwed)
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t600 (2 handed) converter

Villain (t7650)
Hero (t2350)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
Villain calls t300, Hero checks.

Flop: (t900) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero is all-in t1750, Villain calls t1750.

Turn: (t2650) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>

River: (t2650) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>

Final Pot: t2650

Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF">
Villain has 9s 9c (two pair, tens and nines).
Hero has 4h Qd (one pair, tens).
Outcome: Villain wins t2650. </font>

My push was to represent top/middle pair. I felt my push was correct but what I'm curious of is his call.

Was his call justifiable or just dumb? (take his chip lead into account)

[hansarnic]

What does he think you make of his PF limp?

Something small &amp; speculative that wants to see a cheap flop? You don't raise or push PF either which also gives some definition to your range of hands.

So when it comes high he will probably think that you think that it totally missed him, and thus you may well push with any two. Hence I suspect he thinks he's ahead a good portion of the time here.

BTW, would you push with top pair or try to induce a steal from him? I would expect many to do the latter, therefore suspect he may not read you for top pair, further reducing the hands he's behind.

[peanutbutter]

That type of thinking doesn't happen consciously at the table when you have 30 seconds to make a decision. His PF limp to me indicated a small/medium pocket pair, which I think is the wrong move. A push with a PP is definitely the +EV situation because take this hand for example:

Limp in with 99, flop comes KJT, opponent pushes with T2, 99 calls (-EV) and loses

VERSUS:
Push with 99 as the favorite, opponent folds with T2 or calls with T2 and loses

But anyway, I'll ask him what he was thinking later on if I see him at the tables

[hansarnic]

[ QUOTE ]
That type of thinking doesn't happen consciously at the table when you have 30 seconds to make a decision.

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course it does. It's basic hand-reading skills, everyone does it. Agree 30 seconds allows you only to be approximate but the analysis I gave was very high-level and I'd be suprised if a decent $200 player (as I understand he is) isn't thinking about what range of hands you put him on and what actions you will take as a result of your read.

[ QUOTE ]
His PF limp to me indicated a small/medium pocket pair, which I think is the wrong move.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's a very precise read to have just based on a limp.

[ QUOTE ]
A push with a PP is definitely the +EV situation

[/ QUOTE ]

Agree pushing is EV+, but I suppose he thought there was a good chance you'd push PF with a wide range of hands if he limped, which is more EV+.

[ QUOTE ]
because take this hand for example:

Limp in with 99, flop comes KJT, opponent pushes with T2, 99 calls (-EV) and loses

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep. Or take actual hand as it played out as an alternative example.

[ QUOTE ]

But anyway, I'll ask him what he was thinking later on if I see him at the tables

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, would be interesting.

[stillnotking]

His PF limp was a slowplay, not speculation (how do you speculate heads-up with pocket 9s?). He probably thought to himself before the flop, "I'll just call with this hand and then put it in on the flop no matter what". He's hoping you either pick up a draw or a pair less than 9s.

So from a $20+2 player, FWIW: this is not how I would play the hand. I would definitely push PF and hope to be called by a smaller pair or one overcard. But I would push PF with a very wide range of hands here, and my opponent would know that, so I would be more likely to be called than a tighter player like ComeOnPhish.

[Elektrik]

Your push screams weakness. It says that you do not want to show this hand down. You mention you could have had T2o - Would you really even push here with T2o? Most of the time, he is only folding a worse hand; I can't see him releasing a king or a jack for sure, and maybe not even a ten.

I'm not saying I like his call all that much, but I think I can see why he made it.

[jah0550]

[ QUOTE ]
I can't see him releasing a king or a jack for sure, and maybe not even a ten.

I'm not saying I like his call all that much, but I think I can see why he made it.

[/ QUOTE ]
Huh? He called with 9s. I think he definately would call with a K,J, or 10, because HE CALLED WITH 9s. This was a terrible call on his part as he is way behind anything on the board and if he loses will even the stacks out.

[ChrisV]

His preflop limp was an attempt to lure you into a desperation push. Nines are a very strong hand heads up and you're nuts if you think this was him speculating with a low-mid pair. There's no way he would have limped here with 33, for example. FWIW, there are a lot of players I would try the desperation push against here (ComeOnPhish is not one of them).

After the flop, with the pot over two thirds of your stack, your push could be literally anything. Kx is impossible for you, or should be, since you would have pushed preflop, and on the flop would check to induce a steal. Good jacks and tens (JT and up) are likewise impossible. The only hands he's worried about you holding are bad jacks and tens, assuming you don't check to induce a steal with those hands too (I would). But even against those hands he wins 25% of the time thanks to his 6 outs and backdoor straight possibilities. I think it's an OK call, bit questionable. I'm not sure if I would have made it. I'd have to think there's some chance of you having pushed with a hopeless hand.

[Daliman]

You'd have likely gotten him to release his hand if you bet out T600 on the flop, then pushed the turn.

THen again, maybe not. Phish is not one to drop a PP often.

[MagnoliasFM]

Just curious as to why you said your push was to represent top/middle pair. People in that situation normally don't push with top pair, but they frequently push with Qx or a flush draw. Maybe that's what Come0nPhish put you on.