Do you value bet this river?

Cardzy · #1 01-02-2005, 04:39 AM

It wouldn't even be a question, but SB is a tight player. I THINK he has the flush but hard to put him on that since he called on the flop with just a backdoor flush draw? Maybe he limped in preflop with A7, 76s, etc. He very well could have that 7.

Anyway, what do you think? Value raise this river or not?

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, CO folds, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 folds, Button folds, SB calls.

Turn: (4 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, SB calls.

River: (7 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, Hero ???

Danenania · #2 01-02-2005, 04:42 AM

No. Raising here would be terrible. Call and get an overcall.

goofball · #3 01-02-2005, 04:44 AM

this is almost a crying call. it's not a raise

Cardzy · #4 01-02-2005, 04:52 AM

[ QUOTE ]
this is almost a crying call. it's not a raise

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, why is this a crying call? I have a boat for christ's sake. Please explain.

Shillx · #5 01-02-2005, 04:56 AM

I really don't think a tight player will bet a flush in this spot. Just call.

If you raise and he has the flush, he will fold. If he has a 7, he will reraise. Call and go for the overcall.

goofball · #6 01-02-2005, 05:12 AM

you said yourself "he's a tight player"

so first, it's unlikely he had a flush since he would have called a backdoor flush draw on a paired board.
second, if he's a tight player he might not even bet a flush into a double paired board, he certainly wouldn't bet something less
third, you have the worst possible full house.
fourth, if you raise what do you expect to happen?

first of all you knock out the overcaller, second if he has less than a flush he probably folds, third if he has a 7 he 3bets you.

so if you raise, you might get 1 extra bb from the bettor when you are ahead and you will lose 2 when you are behind

if you call you might get an bet from the overcaller, so you might get 1 extra bb when you are ahead, and you will lose 1 bb when you are behind

i know you "have a freaking boat" but remember that doesn't really matter. all that matters is "is my hand better than my opponents" you don't get points fro having a boat if someone else has a bigger boat. a sense of entitlement is a very dangerous thing in poker

Cardzy · #7 01-02-2005, 05:16 AM

Ok, I got it and it makes sense now. Thanks for the replies guys! The only reason I posted this was because I was "tempted" to raise the river. Here is how it actually went down:

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, CO folds, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 folds, Button folds, SB calls.

Turn: (4 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, SB calls.

River: (7 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, Hero calls, UTG+1 folds.

Final Pot: 9 BB

Results:
Hero has 4d 2d (full house, twos full of sevens).
SB has Ah 3h (flush, ace high).
Outcome: Hero wins 9 BB.

goofball · #8 01-02-2005, 05:36 AM

guess he's more of a nit than you thought eh? ;-)

Cardzy · #9 01-02-2005, 05:48 AM

[ QUOTE ]
guess he's more of a nit than you thought eh? ;-)

[/ QUOTE ]

Hehe, yep, guess so.