post flop play...

unfrgvn · #1 08-26-2004, 10:11 AM

I don't think I play very well post flop, I get along by trying to get big hands paid off and aggressive play on the bubble or bubble + 1. Here are a couple examples of hands that are giving me trouble.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (8 handed)

Hero (t965)
UTG (t310)
UTG+1 (t975)
MP1 (t1710)
MP2 (t735)
CO (t580)
Button (t855)
SB (t1870)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls t30, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, CO calls t30, Button calls t30, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (t150) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero bets t75, UTG+1 folds, CO raises to t550 (All-In),

So whats my action? The all-in guy had made no impression on me so far, he'd lost a couple of medium sized pots and this was his first all in. I'd gotten a free ride in the BB and flopped top pair with a mediocre kicker. He limped pre flop, so I can't give him credit for an overpair or even two big overcards, can I? My thinking was he either got real lucky and two paired the flop, caught an OESD, or might be bluffing with an under pair. Of course a set is a possibility, as well as a complete bluff. What would you do?

Hand 2. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] I almost didn't post this hand because of the way I played it, but here we go:

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t15 (8 handed)

Hero (t900)
UTG (t800)
UTG+1 (t475)
MP1 (t1785)
MP2 (t770)
CO (t695)
Button (t915)
SB (t1660)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 calls t15, CO folds, Button calls t15, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (t60) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP2 bets t15, Button folds, SB folds, Hero calls t15.

Turn: (t90) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets t30, Hero folds.

Final Pot: t120
Main Pot: t90 (t90), won by MP2.
Pot 2: t30 (t30), returned to MP2.

Results in white below: 
No showdown. MP2 wins t120. 

My thinking now in the cold light of day is that I should raise the turn? If so, how much? I keep thinking I'll find a better spot to be aggressive but lately those better spots are too far apart to sustain me. I need to take some of these kinds of pots down. Thanks for any advice.

RobGW · #2 08-26-2004, 12:00 PM

I would fold in both hands. Why risk your whole stack this early? Play it safe early, let someone else take down the little pots. Then when the blinds go up and the pots get bigger, you be the aggressor and put them to a decision.

Lori · #3 08-26-2004, 01:12 PM

Hand 1 is an easy fold, there's not really even a point deliberating what he has, you're either in deep poo or a slight fave.
A large bet on a mundane looking board is often a set, and even hands like TJ have a decent chance of beating you.

Hand 2:

I like this play, although I might be tempted to call the 30 as well. I certainly call another 15 and would call the 30 about 30% of the time.

I see no harm at all in investing 15 chips to make him bet bigger at you next time you clash.
Next time you might have a monster.

Lori

unfrgvn · #4 08-26-2004, 02:00 PM

Thanks for the replies, I did fold hand 1 for the reasons you both stated. Just wanted a sanity check. Lori, on hand 2 you wouldn't raise the turn? I thought about just calling to see if I could show the hand down cheap, but it's been drummed in my head to either fold or raise, maybe too much.

I always feel I've been outplayed when I have to fold a marginal hand, don't have that problem when I've got the nuts. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]