Is there a man amoung you who can lay this down?

[ddubois]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t15 (8 handed) converter

saw flop|<font color="C00000">saw showdown</font>

<font color="C00000">Button (t850)</font>
SB (t1185)
<font color="C00000">Hero (t800)</font>
UTG (t1150)
UTG+1 (t775)
MP1 (t1890)
MP2 (t655)
CO (t695)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls t15, <font color="666666">3 folds</font>, CO calls t15, Button calls t15, SB completes, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises to t50</font>, UTG calls t35, CO calls t35, Button calls t35, SB folds.

Flop: (t215) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">Hero bets t200</font>, UTG calls t200, CO folds, <font color="CC3333">Button raises to t800 (All-In)</font>

[durron597]

Yes, and then I proceed to kick myself for making such a stupid preflop raise, and remind myself that this is why I don't raise so small.

[ddubois]

I frankly notice no difference between raising 40 50 60 70 80, you always get callers regardless. As I will only flop TPTK something like 30% of the time (is it less?), I've been very frustrated with AK lately, as it seems I am merely building a pot for someone else to win. (I have been extremely unsuccessful at taking down pots with flop bets when my AK has missed.) This is why I raised only 3.3xBB. I'm not saying it was right - I know conventional wisdom is to raise more with limpers - I'm just giving my rationale at the time.

[poboy]

[ QUOTE ]
I frankly notice no difference between raising 40 50 60 70 80, you always get callers regardless. As I will only flop TPTK something like 30% of the time (is it less?), I've been very frustrated with AK lately, as it seems I am merely building a pot for someone else to win. (I have been extremely unsuccessful at taking down pots with flop bets when my AK has missed.) This is why I raised only 3.3xBB. I'm not saying it was right - I know conventional wisdom is to raise more with limpers - I'm just giving my rationale at the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

This early in a game raising it to T50 is begging for callers. Early on I like to raise more than 3XBB, for exactly this reason. A bet of T120 or T150 would have probably been more appropriate, and even if he has 66 he probably lays it down. Granted you win a smaller pot most of the time, but it beats losing chips. If you do get a call at least than you can be fairly sure your opponent doesn't have something like K6 or 66. Just my thoughts....

[greytedeals]

i would call the all in. if he had the six, i think a smaller raise would be more appropriate, or even just a call. he might have Kx, or even 2 hearts.. just my opinion though

[EdCota]

Not on Party.

[Gramps]

The button's play screams flush draw or even a King/worse kicker. Many people would wait til the Turn to pop you with a 6. I'd call.

[durron597]

Alright I thought I had replied to this earlier but apparently it didn't go through.

Let's look at what you did: you raised T35 units into a T70 pot. So you weren't even giving the people to act after you 3:1 odds to call you (risking 35 to win 105). Since any non-dominated hand is never worse than a 65:35 dog, they should easily call you with any two cards.

Now if you had raised to make it more like 135 to go, then they would have to call 120 into a 215 pot, which is much worse odds for them to call. Plus there's the added psychological factor of "wow, that's a big raise" that will make some idiots fold. Plus it's more than 1/7 your stack, so the people who are counting on implied odds from low PPs to hit their set will fold, too.

The reason why you don't see any difference between raising 40 50 60 70 80 is that all of them are too low. Make a real raise, especially with three limpers.

[adanthar]

Easy, easy, EASY raise to either 75 or 100 PF, hence your problem.

I then bet far less- 125 or so- on this flop. This is a standard for me; I'm not making the flush draw fold on level 1 at Party no matter what, and if I have a choice between overbetting the flop or turn, I'm taking the turn (especially on this flop, on which I'm either way ahead or way behind and would like to see the action develop.)

Given this action, I think long and hard and then (probably) fold the flop- not because the button scares me that much, but because they probably don't *both* have flush draws and UTG's flop call spells trouble. Having said that, had I raised to T75+ PF, I would have called.

[lastchance]

Yeah, I lay that down. Like someone else said, UTG's call means trouble, and that means you're probably beat. The raise you made was weak. Sometimes, you do want to avoid a bullet early, but I want chips in with AKs, and I also want to be heads up.