Rate my play

SpiderMnkE · #1 08-03-2004, 05:52 PM

Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (9 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

SB ($81.75)
BB ($81.75)
UTG ($46)
UTG+1 ($41.25)
MP1 ($10.50)
MP2 ($49)
MP3 ($43.50)
CO ($61.75)
Hero ($97.50)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $1.
BB folds, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls $1, MP1 folds, MP2 calls $1, MP3 folds, CO folds, Hero raises to $4, SB (poster) calls $3, UTG+1 calls $3, MP2 folds.

Flop: ($13) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $9, SB calls $9, UTG+1 calls $9.

Turn: ($40) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $30, SB calls $30, UTG+1 folds.

River: ($100) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $54.5 (All-In), SB calls $38.75 (All-In).

Final Pot: $193.25
Main Pot: $177.50, between SB and Hero.
Pot 2: $15.75, returned to Hero.

JrJordan · #2 08-03-2004, 06:14 PM

I like most of your play here. Preflop raise seems fairly standard, although with 2 limpers before me, sometimes I find a $5 PF raise can limit the field down to 1-2 instead of 3. Thats just nit picking though.

Flop: Overpair with 3rd nut flush draw. Can't imagine you want to see a fourth spade. It'll either kill your action from the nonspades, or kill your stack when you lose it to a lone A or K of spades. I'd probably make it a full pot bet here to try and take the pot here and now. That, or you're charging the draws a lot more to play.

Turn: Still have to imagine you're ahead here, but much harder to play against 2 opponents instead of 3. I may bet a little less, around $25 here. It makes it a little easier to get out against a check raise, while still charging a good arm and a leg for the draw.

River: This is the bet I'm not too happy about. I can't find too many hands that the SB would call your bet that you beat. A missed draw would quickly fold, which is what I'd put him on up to this point. Maybe AJ will call, but I imagine he would make a move on the turn instead. A tricky player might slowplay a flush to the river with another check/all in. I'd be thankful my QQ stayed an overpair and gladly check it down for an already large pot.

I made a post earlier last week with TPTK getting check/called to the river. The majority sided with me checking the river as well for the same reasons I outlined. Obviously the overpair is better than TPTK, but with a monochrome flush on the board, I can't you face a similar risk of being slowplayed by a monster.

SpiderMnkE · #3 08-03-2004, 06:26 PM

This is why I posted this hand.. I don't think the river bet was good. I think it was real bad.

I think that is a normal checkthrough for me.. except the guy I was playing was reallly bad. I saw him call a $17 pf raise with A9o. He would call a lot... I guess I let my read overrate the betting language of the hand.

He had J7 spades.. MHING

SpiderMnkE · #4 08-03-2004, 06:29 PM

I've also been checking through the river A LOT lately.. and I feel that I'm not able to tell when I should value bet. Clearly this was not it.. haha.

Oh well live and learn.. still tilt free!!

GoSox · #5 08-03-2004, 06:46 PM

I like preflop and flop. With two callers on that big a flop bet though I'm shutting down. I would check the turn for sure and see what betting you get on the river. You're giving up a free card but at least you're only faced with one bet to deal with and they act first.

JrJordan · #6 08-03-2004, 07:01 PM

I know the feeling with river value bets. I've come to the conclusions that with overpair and TPTK, there are no river value bets. Unless the guy is a total idiot and will call with a weak kicker on 3 straight rounds, your best bet is to check through. That being said, TPTK and overpairs are great bluff inducers when out of position. From EP, this river check works wonders to get someone to toss another $10 in.

On a side note, your opponent still played the hand pretty bad. With UTG+1 cold calling the flop and your betting, he has to be worried about a higher spade coming along for the four flush. In his shoes I'd reraise this flop 99% of the time and hope to get someone all in before more cards come.

Justin A · #7 08-03-2004, 07:10 PM

Getting all your chips in the middle with one pair on a monotone flop is not good. I agree with GoSox, I'd be done with this as soon as my flop bet got called in two places. Your hand just isn't strong enough to back your stack up with. The river bet is just awful though. Was it a value bet or a bluff? Either way it was a mistake, and you should have taken the free showdown.

Justin A

SpiderMnkE · #8 08-03-2004, 07:14 PM

Yeah... like I said.. I got carried away with a read... insano calling station... but still.. who calls $30 on the turn with something that can't beat QQ.. hahaha

Not even him I guess

Sifmole · #9 08-03-2004, 08:02 PM

Me too...

I've recently stopped betting the river most of time, unless I have an extremely good hand ( nuts or a close second ); and have found my variance decreased significantly. I win decent pots with my good hands and don't end up blowing it on an over-aggressive river bet.

I changed my style here after a re-read of "Theory of Poker". I found that I was doing exactly what it warned about -- making a bet that would only be called by a hand that beat me, a completely -EV play.