QQ flopped quads

stillbr · #1 03-19-2005, 10:28 PM

Reads with my notes on them

BB is LP_P -- BIG calling station-value bet this dude like a mofo..called down with A high in 4 way pot

UTG+1 is LA_P

MP1 is TA_P - Only seems to bet out w/ TP-GK. Becomes very passive after getting raised-even with fairly strong hands.

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. CO posts a blind of $3.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, 1 fold, MP1 calls, 2 folds, CO (poster) checks, Hero raises, 1 fold, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, CO calls.

Flop: (10.33 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, CO folds, Hero calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (7.16 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.

River: (11.16 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls.

Final Pot: 15.16 BB

Correct river raise? I think a raise here has more value than overcalls considering my reads. What do you think?

Harv72b · #2 03-20-2005, 12:17 AM

I think that given your reads, a raise on the turn might have been better. The calling station in the BB is probably more likely to call 2 BBs cold when there's one more card to come, and you know that MP1 is betting with at least a K, so he's likely to call your turn raise & probably the ensuing river bet. You could also be missing bets in the rare instances when MP1 has KK or he fills up with a K on the river.

The problem with waiting til the river to raise a monster in a 4-way pot is that there aren't any draws left to convince your opponents they're still in the hand. On this board (2-suited, highly coordinated), there are plenty of drawing hands which a loose/passive will call 2 on the turn with, but fold UI on the river.

slavic · #3 03-20-2005, 12:38 AM

stillbr -

I'm writing this to you but I really am just saying this in general for everyone. It doesn't matter how you play this hand, they come up so rarely that they do not contribute much at all to your overall win rate. Literally you could fold this hand on the flop and it just doesn't matter.

So you should really concentrate on hands were making correct decisions are a little more not so obvious. Quads are nice but TPTK is were the money is at.

-slavic

mantasm · #4 03-20-2005, 02:08 AM

"I value call my nuts."

wrto4556 · #5 03-20-2005, 02:34 AM

[ QUOTE ]
"I value call my nuts."

[/ QUOTE ]

"All the second places in these two man tournaments! UNBELIEVABLE!"

Shillx · #6 03-20-2005, 03:20 AM

This hand blows ass. Raise the flop. Anyway, focus energy on hands that come up all the time. You could fold on the flop everytime you flop quads and you would hardly notice it in the bottom line.

Brad

stillbr · #7 03-20-2005, 04:32 AM

[ QUOTE ]
This hand blows ass. Raise the flop. Anyway, focus energy on hands that come up all the time. You could fold on the flop everytime you flop quads and you would hardly notice it in the bottom line.

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

Focusing my enegery from now on [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]. Nobody post any hands that arnt TPTK or youll get your ass chewed out. Just because this hand doesnt come up much doesnt mean its not interesting to discuss.

Raising the flop here seems retarted to me. You must love to try and knock out opponents when you have stone cold nuts.

bakku · #8 03-20-2005, 04:47 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Just because this hand doesnt come up much doesnt mean its not interesting to discuss.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, but this hand is uninteresting.

[ QUOTE ]
Raising the flop here seems retarted to me. You must love to try and knock out opponents when you have stone cold nuts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Waiting for the river is retarted.

CaliStyle · #9 03-20-2005, 04:52 AM

Raising is the right play no matter what comes out. If someone has another full house then they are going to three bet and you can cap, if someone made a straight they are going to probably at least call on the river or overplay their hand thinking you have ace queen. And if they were on flushes they are not going to call anyways so make the guy pay that already bet into you with his king most likely. Overcalling is something you should rarely do. Save that for special circumstances, such as your it got checked on the flop, checked on the turn, and bet on the river. You are holding the nut straight and the person next to you bets out and there are five people behind you to act. Then just smooth call and hope someone raises, chances are no one can call a raise but maybe up to three people can call with top pair or something.

CaliStyle · #10 03-20-2005, 04:54 AM

Good point. Raise the turn. Make the draws pay.