How to lose a bankroll.

[1800GAMBLER]

First time ever i went bust. It's just a stage, not even a big stage of poker for me because i semi-cleared the account anyhow. $2.5/$5 $500 buy in with after a bad session of having 6 buy ins i'm at 3.

After i run over the table for a while i get JJ, my first legit raising hand.

3 limpers and i raise to 6 times the blinds, $30, coldcaller behind rest fold.

Flop:

3 8 6r

I bet the pot, he calls.

Turn: A

I pot bet. He calls.

River: 9

I go all in, he calls.

He shows A2o, i rebuy, complainning, which i don't normally.


Wayhey 2 hands later JJ! I raise 5 blinds. He coldcalls again.

Flop:

9 3 5r

I pot bet. Calls.

Turn:

K.

I pot bet, calls.

River:

A.

I check and call his min. bet and he shows A7s.

I semi-buy for half the buy in just on a mild tilt laughing this time.

Right after get 98s and raise 8blinds, he calls again.

Flop:

6 9 7r

I push in. He calls.

Turn:

8.

River:

6.

He shows A6s. I don't rebuy, i laugh, bitch, post, sleep.

Stories? 'I told you' sos?

[Guy McSucker]

Jay,

Those are beats, sure enough. I feel for you. And I am not going to say "I told you so" because I didn't.

I will say this. You are clearly a very aggressive player, and you have been very successful with this strategy. But, when you're super-aggressive, sometimes people are going to call you down with any pair, and sometimes they are going to outdraw you. For instance, the 98 hand: you have posted several hands where you played AK just the same way, so you can see why this guy might call... If you have AK he's got you drawing to three outs after the flop here.

Also, when you're losing heavily, people begin to expect to beat you. Time to reign in the betting when you don't really have them locked up.

You'll be back, I have no doubt.

Guy.

[1800GAMBLER]

Yeah, beats are beats. I'll be back on that account tonight, i'll reserve one of my cash ins. I just found those calls of his amazing. That's some pretty bad play for someone at those stakes.

[daryn]

weird.. the A hits, you bet the pot... he calls.... and then you go all in on the river?

[Greg (FossilMan)]

[ QUOTE ]
That's some pretty bad play for someone at those stakes.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL! You ain't seen nothin' yet.

Wait until you play 10-25 blind PLO with a bunch of European gamblers.

Later, Greg Raymer (FossilMan)

[pokerwhore]

what about AA vs KK ???

[1800GAMBLER]

You check to that ace!? O_O

edit: I should give more of a reply than that.

His calling a bet there doesn't change anything, he should know that i haven't played my hand like an ace, so i don't improve with that turn card, so his hand from the flop doesn't need to change. Standards don't change here.

The next hand is an example of it.

Nor does the river card change anything other than a 57 (doubtful) draw being completed. Or the more likely, but still unlikely 79 9T giving him a overpair (to the flop).

In short, there ratio of an unknown player calling hands on the flop which i beat compared to the ratio of hands in which he has an ace in so hugely in my favour.

[1800GAMBLER]

Yeah, i had a deep stack meet a deep stack in 1/2 when i had KK only to see some annoying chatter to have AA. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[tewall]

The problem's not betting the turn, it's going all-in on the river after you've been called.

[Guy McSucker]

I am not sure how big Jay's stack was at that point. He says "I'm at 3" but I don't know if he means $300 or 3 buyins, i.e. $1500.

If it's $300 then he only had a few bucks left on the river.

Guy.

[1800GAMBLER]

Refresh, i edited my post.

[1800GAMBLER]

I'm at 3 was referring to my bankroll before the start of this session after a bad session with pokerwhore and a few other sessions/withdrawls.

In the hand i had just around $400 - $450.

[turnipmonster]

[ QUOTE ]

3 limpers and i raise to 6 times the blinds, $30, coldcaller behind rest fold.


[/ QUOTE ]

why such a big raise? is that your standard open? assuming you have one caller and someone is always betting the pot, you're risking 30+60+120+240=450=your whole stack, with JJ. I wouldn't do it, but that's me.

If he's calling such a raise preflop, I think it's hard not to give him overcards to your JJ at this point, making you about even money. If you are an aggressive player, you are commiting yourself to risking your stack (via betting the pot out of position) on this hand.

[ QUOTE ]

Flop:
3 8 6r
I bet the pot, he calls.


[/ QUOTE ]

great flop!

[ QUOTE ]

Turn: A

I pot bet. He calls.


[/ QUOTE ]

he just called your pot bet with a scare card on board. your hand screams pocket pair, or maybe AK. he is telling you that, by calling your bet, he isn't too worried about what you represent. There aren't any draws out here to speak of, so at this point what do you put him on? and of that, what can you beat?

[ QUOTE ]

He shows A2o, i rebuy, complainning, which i don't normally.


[/ QUOTE ]

wow, so he's a really terrible player. I think you could have lost a lot less if you had opened for less preflop.

--turnipmonster

[1800GAMBLER]

Line by line.

'why such a big raise? is that your standard open?'

No, it's not. But with JJ it's a marginal hand. If i can do a small mistake to narrow a large mistake i will, proof will follow.


'assuming you have one caller and someone is always betting the pot, you're risking 30+60+120+240=450=your whole stack, with JJ. I wouldn't do it, but that's me.'

You really need to give examples of were i am risking my whole stack. If i make this raise and only get called my overcards that's perfect! 2/3 they'll miss the flop then were do they stand with there AK AQ KQ!? Meanwhile i can see an overcard and escape if i want to play it that way.

' I think it's hard not to give him overcards to your JJ at this point, making you about even money.'

AK does not go past the flop! That's not even money.

'great flop!'

50/50 flop of overcard. 2/3 flop he hits.

'he just called your pot bet with a scare card on board.'

Huh?

'so at this point what do you put him on? and of that, what can you beat? '

We aren't playing WSOP winners. We are playing 1/2 gamblers, decent, good players. At this point they cold have, a draw, a middle pair, a top pair. Which plus them together is way less then a set.

'wow, so he's a really terrible player. I think you could have lost a lot less if you had opened for less preflop.'

Just because i could have lost less in _this one hand_ doesn't mean it's a way to play it in general.

There are about 3 quotes in your post which assume i play this way all the time. I don't, each situation is different to the last.

[turnipmonster]

damn, I wrote a response and then lost it. I'm not criticizing your general play at all, just the preflop play of this specific hand. I apologize if my reply came across as sounding like that at all. on to my responses:

'No, it's not. But with JJ it's a marginal hand. If i can do a small mistake to narrow a large mistake i will'

if it's not your standard open then IMHO you are giving away too much info, unless you would play AA-KK the same. a big raise pegs you on a big but very vulnerable hand.

'You really need to give examples of were i am risking my whole stack.'

your strategy on this hand seemed to be "unless a scare card *flops*, I am going to bet the pot on every street". betting the pot on every street means you are going all in by the river, for sure.

'he just called your pot bet with a scare card on board.'

Huh?

An A came on the turn, and he called your pot bet. he is telling you he isn't scared of an A.

What kind of draw do you think he has? and if he does have a draw in this spot, then he is certainly also dumb enough to call your flop bet with AK, so I don't think you can rule out him having an A.

'There are about 3 quotes in your post which assume i play this way all the time. I don't, each situation is different to the last.'

Again, I apologize if I came across this way, it was unintentional.

All I am saying here is your open for $30 turns your stack into a short stack, considering you only barely have enough to call pot size bets until the river. I would not like to be in this spot at all with this hand, but that's me, and there is clearly more than one way to win at this game.

--turnipmonster

[1800GAMBLER]

I switch my raising size a lot. I don't switch them hand dependant though. They switch with limpers, position, stack sizes, game type, players on the blinds. If anyone cracks that they could be making more money away from the table.

'your strategy on this hand seemed to be "unless a scare card *flops*, I am going to bet the pot on every street". betting the pot on every street means you are going all in by the river, for sure. '

Against general weak players i will be. Against a good solid player i'd slow down on the turn regardless of the card.

'An A came on the turn, and he called your pot bet. he is telling you he isn't scared of an A.'

Not true. Actually it is true. But for the following reasons to:

- He thinks the A didn't help me.
- He has a hand regardless of the A. Set or draw.

'What kind of draw do you think he has? and if he does have a draw in this spot, then he is certainly also dumb enough to call your flop bet with AK, so I don't think you can rule out him having an A. '

True. But the probability of 8x + draw + overpair is > P(AK) and it's not even close.

I like big raises with QQ JJ more than any other hand because i want Ax Kx x being a rag out so i can lead at the overcard more often.