AQo hell

[boondockst]

The PFR had some pretty tight stats...I'd easily fold to his PFR but not with all that money out there. Then once the flop came I had to see where I was at.

Once the flop came out, I had to see where I was....What street do i slow down? Anyone like the river bet? Ax Kh is the only thing i see calling.


Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 5 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

saw flop|<font color="#C00000">saw showdown</font>

Button ($40.35)
Hero ($85.65)
BB ($47.73)
UTG ($27.35)
MP ($33.85)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/club.gif. Hero posts a blind of $0.10.
UTG calls $0.25, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Button calls $0.25, <font color="#CC3333">Hero (poster) raises to $0.65</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises to $2.75</font>, UTG calls $2.75, Button calls $2.75, Hero calls $2.25.

Flop: ($12) 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $5</font>, BB calls $5, UTG calls $5, Button folds.

Turn: ($27) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $13</font>, BB calls $13, UTG calls $13.

River: ($66) Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $13????</font>

Oh boy.

Even with all the money out there, I like a fold preflop if this guy has tight stats. And now you know why.

I don't like that flop size bet. What are you trying to do?

After your flop bet get's called by BB and UTG, and the turn is probably the worst possible turn card imaginable, I give up, no more money of mine goes in the pot unless it get's checked around and I river an ace.

The river bet is a very bad bet. worse hands fold, and better hands call.

[boondockst]

So i should check/fold the turn and river in this ginormous pot? What do you put them on that they flat call the flop with? And with deeper stacks, I dont see how I can fold getting 4.33 to 1 closing the action.

[troymclur]

Well, you underbet every street. I wouldn't even bet the river, but with such an underbet, damned near any haert will call, and with three players to the river, you can be sure that there's a decently high one out there.

Pot the flop, and if called, slow the hell down. Doubtful there's a fullhouse, though the river could have filled up the BB. To be honest, i think you were good until the river.

Unless of course some moron horribly played AK.

[boondockst]

Can someone please put them on hands? Because I sure as hell couldn't

And I am never EVER potting this flop against these players.

BTW all my bets were horrid attempts at faux "blocking bets"

First raise I was shutting down completely.

I think I just have to check/fold this river I'm afraid. Somebody must surely hold a heart in their hand, if not a full house from a badly played AA? I may call a reasonable bet but I just concede this pot at the river. Your $13 bet is absolutely begging to be raised from the BB, as he's pretty much committed he's likely to push with any hand he came this far with. Either bet nearer half the pot, which puts both villians ALL-IN or just check it and fold/call it IMO.

I don't like raising this hand in the SB, especially such a small bet as 0.65. You've now built the pot for a hand which is far from made, OOP to all villians for the whole hand. If you raise, raise it higher to make sure you can get heads up. You need to define your hand as a strong one so you have at least some fold equity if the flop misses and you make a continuation bet. I also fold to the re-raise. AA, AK, KK, QQ all have you in bad shape and with a tight villian, playing out of the BB I have to give him credit for one of these hands. As it is, calling has got you into trouble when you hit the flop, but don't know how hard it has also hit your villians.

[boondockst]

[ QUOTE ]
The river bet is a very bad bet. worse hands fold, and better hands call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Worse hands fold? There's nothing to draw to. Are you saying bet less so that AKo calls? "Worse hands fold" refers to turn bets or the size of a river bet. Are you suggesting i check/call to induce a bluff?

Oh right didn't notice the deep stacks. It's not as bad as I thought, but I still fold preflop. The only way the deeper stacks are good for you is if you flop two pair or better, I rather have just about any other hand than AQo.

Well, BB could be trying to be 'sneaky' with AA, or could have AK and feels comfortable with you doing the betting, or have KK/QQ/JJ and can't lay it down. UTG might have a flush draw, maybe Ax, or maybe 22. I'd be very worried about the /images/graemlins/heart.gif's thought from UTG

But about the preflop call, is there any hand that you wouldn't call with? Because AQo IMO is one of the worst to do it with

BB COULD possibly be holding KK? Your flop bet was weak, maybe he doesn't believe you have an Ace. Although if that's the case he SHOULD have raised or folded. But on the turn he could have picked up a flush draw, with the K of hearts perhaps?

UTG we don't have any stats on? If he's tight he'll probably have a pocket pair, now again he should be raising the flop though.. it all depends on how aggressive and loose your villians are to be able to put them on hands successfully.

[ QUOTE ]
Worse hands fold? There's nothing to draw to. Are you saying bet less so that AKo calls? "Worse hands fold" refers to turn bets or the size of a river bet. Are you suggesting i check/call to induce a bluff?

[/ QUOTE ]

That comment was about the river bet. I am suggesting that check/calling is better than betting. But better than both of those I think is check/folding

[NYCNative]

When you are reraised, what are you beating here? Well, you might be in a coinflip against Jacks. If he's not a donk, that's the best you can hope for. Otherwise you're calling a bet dominated. So I fold AQ against a reraise here.

Once you're in the hand, you need to play it a lot stronger than you did because your bets reek of weakness (another reason to fold PF - you hit the flop as well as you could reasonably expect, TP2K, and you're still scared). You price in draws and a smart villain will sense your weakness and make you make a tough decision even if you have the best hand.

As played, you have to bet at least $10 on the flop. AK will let you know he's there and then you can shut it down.

I wouldn't have bet the turn at all and even thinking about being in the hand at the river makes my head hurt. There's no way you're ahead here. Your only hope is that the person with the heart sees your small bet as a value bet with a boat and folds instead of looking you up, unlikely at this level.

[boondockst]

All in all, a hellacious hand. A friend of mine was watching the hand and after the BB reraised preflop, I told him (teaching him the game) that based on his stats (one previous session too) I would easily lay it down unless both UTG and Button called.

I bet so weak on the flop so I could exit the hand easily. I admit it is a very poor strategy but I didn't want to bet the pot on the flop because if BB flat called and UTG pushed, I would still have tremendous odds to call and be in an even stickier situation. I was begging to be raised throughout the hand and it never happened. On the river, I honestly put BB on AK and prayed it wasn't Ax Kh. I suppose if he has that I want to check and hope he bets but I duno.

not to whine but i had just lost with AA on an A9Tr flop to JJ all in on flop (KQ)

my head was spinning and this AQ hand made me sick for 15 minutes after i played it.

[b]Both villains folded the river and their hands will forever be a mystery.

[swolfe]

check the flop and see what kind of action happens. if BB leads out and there are any callers/raisers, you'll have more information than what you got by making a weak lead. the ideal situation would be him making a continuation bet and everyone else folding...you MIGHT be ahead then.

[boondockst]

I really don't think BB would make a cont bet into 2 players behind with an underpair here. His stats were not only tight but very weak tight. If it checks around, then what's my plan?

[swolfe]

[ QUOTE ]
I really don't think BB would make a cont bet into 2 players behind with an underpair here. His stats were not only tight but very weak tight. If it checks around, then what's my plan?

[/ QUOTE ]
probably bet...

[boondockst]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Worse hands fold? There's nothing to draw to. Are you saying bet less so that AKo calls? "Worse hands fold" refers to turn bets or the size of a river bet. Are you suggesting i check/call to induce a bluff?

[/ QUOTE ]

That comment was about the river bet. I am suggesting that check/calling is better than betting. But better than both of those I think is check/folding

[/ QUOTE ]

What hand that I beat bets the river if I check yet didn't raise the flop or turn?

[boondockst]

I'm still dying for someone to put them on hands....UTG = weak ace? BB = KK or AK?

[ QUOTE ]
What hand that I beat bets the river if I check yet didn't raise the flop or turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

I dunno, maybe KK no heart from BB who realizes you have an ace. I think the chances of some one bluffing the river are near zero.

But I also think the chances you get called by AK no heart are near zero. Maybe betting is better than check/calling, maybe

But the important thing is check/folding is the move

That'd be my guess

[swolfe]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm still dying for someone to put them on hands....UTG = weak ace? BB = KK or AK?

[/ QUOTE ]

BB=KK, UTG=baby flush, maybe weak A

[boondockst]

but swolfe what is UTG's HAND...ace-rag with rag of hearts?

I don't see a low pair sticking in after a bet and call on the flop

[ QUOTE ]
I don't see a low pair sticking in after a bet and call on the flop

[/ QUOTE ]

I do, I've seen worse

[boondockst]

You guys do realize this is NL25 right? $5 on the flop and $13 on the turn are big bets to call at this level, regardless of the pot size.

[mayesie]

Although there's alot of money in the pot before the flop, I'd still have to seriously consider laying this down:

- Your hand could easily be dominated by AK (or worse)
- Your're not suited, so your semi-bluffing potential is shot
- Your position after the flop sucks



You're not likely to "find out where you're at" by betting less than 1/2 the pot w/ an Ace &amp; 2 Hearts showing. If you have to play this, bet 10.00 or so. If you encounter any action, you're done w/ the hand.

The turn bet is inexcuseable; don;t even think about betting the river!

Agree with most of whats been said here so far, good advice. Preflop is a clear fold (best scenario has you behind jacks or queens, but dominant AK, KK, or AA is more likely) Reasoning for river bet? I know it worked and you took the pot but I'm very surprised it did and just want to know what you wanted to accomplish?

[Lucky]

BB or UTG is way ahead. Dont put yourself in spots to get a good flop and lose all your money.

[yvesaint]

whats up with the mini-raise pre-flop (yes, its a miniraise)

whats up with calling buttons re-raise with AQo, especially with tight stats, youre easily dominated / drawing to 3 outs here

bet more on the flop, you didnt even bet half pot

river bet sucks unless it's a complete bluff, they arent folding a heart for 13 bucks into a 70+ pot