KK played poorly - did I play this as bad as I think?

PokerStars 0.02/0.04 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is CO with K/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+2 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, MP3 calls, Hero calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG folds, UTG+2 calls.

Flop: (12 SB) 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 7/images/graemlins/club.gif, 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, UTG+2 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, MP3 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB folds, UTG+2 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
MP2 checks, MP3 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

River: (12 BB) 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
MP2 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 bets</font>, Hero calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 18 BB


I walked away from this hand feeling like I played it all wrong and shouldn't have been in to the river. Do you agree with that sentiment?


edit: Just noticed this post is in the wrong forum as its a nano game. Is there forgiveness for a first hand post?

[hemstock]

You should alwayse raise KK preflop no matter what. You played the rest of the hand good IMO. You're only beaten by a 9 or AA. Calling down is a must.

You SHOULD have been in till the river

[gharp]

First, edit out the "I should note..." line, it can taint your replies.

Second, why didn't you 3-bet preflop?

Third, the hand would play differently if you had 3-bet preflop, but I think you played fine post-flop given what happened.

Thanks for the tip on removing the line. Done.

Honestly looking back I can't figure out why I didn't. At the time I might have been thinking that a preflop raise hasn't done much to thin the field as of yet, but I also hadn't considered the bonus of getting an extra bet into the pot from all players. Thanks for the tip as I can already see where I lost out on a bigger pot at the risk of one or two extra small bets preflop.

[aces_dad]

Is there a reason you didn't 3bet this preflop? Other than that I think you played this hand fine

edit: except the river I go to war here and cap if possible.

That 9 on the river is a very good card for you, it reduces the chances of someone holding a 9 and makes you the second nut boat. Why do you think you should have gotten out of this hand?

[UATrewqaz]

Well it doesn't take a genius to see you won the hand. The only hands you lose to are AA and nobody showed any early aggression, and 9x, and once again nobody showed that much aggression on that board.

But you did play the hand poorly. You RAISE preflop, there are alot of people in already and they all have weaker hands than you (almost certainly, barring the unlikely KK/AA) therefor you are building a big pot you are the favorite to win (and by favorite I mean by plurality, not necessarily majority).

THe flop is somewhat co-ordinated but you were proper in raising, at best you figure someone has an open-ended or more likely gutshot draw.

The turn is a little scary but you can't slow down with such a big overpair.

The river is actually fantastic for you as you now have any straight beaten and it makes it UBER unlikely someone has a 9 considering 3 are on the board. Therefore it's pretty clear the bettor has 6 or 7 or a pocket pair lower than AA and a worse full house.

[numeri]

Holy passive, Batman. 3-bet preflop!

I might raise the river after MP3 bets, but whatever you do - don't fold!

Edit: Also wanted to mention that nano-limit questions are usually fine here. Many of us have experience there. (0.01/0.2, 0.02/0.04, 0.05/0.10, and 0.25/0.50 myself.)

First off, as the other posters noted you should definitely 3-bet the flop. But other than that I think you played it fine. I like your raise on the flop, you may have forced out gutshot straightdraws, etc. My guess on the turn would have been that MP3 was on a straightdraw, because he hadn't shown any aggression. That's why you have to bet the turn - you can't let anyone with an 8 see a card for free. And then on the river, you can be pretty confident you're good. I might even three bet the river, although I might be too scared of the 9.

[baronzeus]

You can go for overcalls the first time on the river but you need to raise it when it comes back to you.


BTW RAISE PREFLOP. YOU LOST LIKE 3-4BB BY NOT DOING SO

Yeah I feel like it was passive play on my part and that's probably one part that eats at me. I'm a fairly new poker player, having picked up the game just a few months ago, and trying like mad to utilize the resources I can to learn and adjust. At the time I was almost sure I was behind to the 4 of a kind, regardless of the fact that the odds were greatly in my favor. I knew I could beat any other full house, except for full of aces. It was that one card scaring me off when it really shouldn't. Thanks for the replies all, they're much appreciated.

Pre-Flop: I think you should have raised. You may well have knocked out a weak PF hand which ended up getting a straight, a straight draw, or maybe quads.

Flop: I like the raise to knock out others in a big pot. MP2 could also have whiffed on the flop and has only overcards -- or perhaps QQ-TT.

Turn: I bet. I wouldn't put anyone on a set or straight at this point. MP2, for the reasons stated above, I think has higher cards, or maybe a straight draw (i.e., a Ten in his hand). MP3 hasn't shown any strength, and I'm thinking he's on a straight draw at this point.

River (edited after putting on my glasses): Call both the bet and raise. If you lose to quads (or AA999, which I doubt) with this FH in a large pot, then oh well.

EDIT: After reading others' posts, I think you're good on the river and should try to extract more bets. So, I probably would have raised the initial bet and definitely would have re-raised.

[baronzeus]

[ QUOTE ]
I think I fold to the bet (I don't want to!) and definitely fold to the raise. I'm pretty sure you're beat when MP3 has been there the whole way and now wakes up, but I'm almost certain your beat when MP2 raises MP3 and you and MP3 calls his raise.

[/ QUOTE ]


This is bad. You have the 3rd nuts. Just assume no one has the 9 and you have the 2nd nuts.


i'd 3bet the river.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think I fold to the bet (I don't want to!) and definitely fold to the raise. I'm pretty sure you're beat when MP3 has been there the whole way and now wakes up, but I'm almost certain your beat when MP2 raises MP3 and you and MP3 calls his raise.

[/ QUOTE ]


This is bad. You have the 3rd nuts. Just assume no one has the 9 and you have the 2nd nuts.


i'd 3bet the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

/images/graemlins/blush.gif You're right. I didn't read the board right the first time through. I was editing my post as you were replying to my initial one. Sorry about that.

[ReptileHouse]

Raise preflop.

Raise and cap it if no-one else does. There's a ton of lesser hands that will call here that you beat (QQ, JJ, TT, 88, etc).

Lets see here:

Raise PF, you're holding the game's 2nd best hand.

Nice line on the flop, your raise kills odds for anyone drawing. You're also holding a monster overpair, so feel free to keep betting. MP2's call here seems to indicate he didn't land his set.

Turn's fine as well. The river...what, do you think someone is actually holding the fourth nine? You would've seen a raise on the turn if anything. MP2 hasn't shown any indication that he has a nine past the flop since he called your flop raise and checked the turn to you. His raise here seems like a last ditch effort to flush you out of this hand. 3-bet this.

I'm rereading your statement at the end of the post and I don't understand. Why wouldn't you be in on this hand all the way? You're holding a massive overpair this whole time. The check to you on the turn by both seems to indicate neither has a nine--bet into them for value now that you're holding two pair. You landing a boat even kills any straights, so you NEED to 3-bet that river.

Again, anyone else who reads this can feel free to call me out on anything.

[A_K]

Grunch.

Dude, 3-bet PF!

I'm feeling a bit LAGish today, but I would raise the river. Do you think MP3 was slowplaing a nine all of this time? You are behind only a nine and pocket aces.

Can't see why you think that you shouldn't have been in the hand on the river.

[GTSamIAm]

3-bet river.

[Sarge85]

[ QUOTE ]


I walked away from this hand feeling like I played it all wrong and shouldn't have been in to the river. Do you agree with that sentiment?


[/ QUOTE ]

Fear not the quads
Fear not the aces

Bet Bet Bet. I bet we see Tens or Jacks on the river.

Sarge/images/graemlins/diamond.gif

[Duerig]

Some things to consider:

-If any of your opponents held a 9, they would most likely have check raised you on the turn.
-If MP2 had AA, he would have most likely 3 bet you on the flop.

I think raising this river is very important.

Oh and there is no nanos forum. This post is in exactly the right place.

[Duerig]

[ QUOTE ]
You can go for overcalls the first time on the river

[/ QUOTE ]

I wouldn't go for overcalls when there are only 3 people in the pot and the board is this scary. I raise it the first time.