When Do you Give Up? [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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Bobbrt1329

04-15-2005, 11:00 AM

One-on-one against a total fish - Is there a point where I should have just given up and called?

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
Hero raises, 8 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (4.50 SB) 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB calls.

Turn: (3.25 BB) J/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB raises, Hero 3-bets, BB caps, Hero calls.

River: (11.25 BB) 6/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB raises, Hero 3-bets, BB caps, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 19.25 BB

bisonbison

04-15-2005, 11:13 AM

When he checkraises me on the river. You went one bridge too far.

meep_42

04-15-2005, 11:15 AM

[ QUOTE ]
When he checkraises me on the river. You went one bridge too far.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's what I thought.

The fish isn't check-raising the river with a set or two-pair here, it's time to simmer down.

-d

CanKid

04-15-2005, 11:20 AM

don't 3 bet river

ckessel

04-15-2005, 11:22 AM

Hmm, I think you've got to cap it all the way. One one hand beats you, the nut flush and he'd to have two cards. I've seen a lot of fish cap out with trips and lower flushes and even just 2-pair.

Given you posted at all, you probably got hosed, but I think the range of hands likely in this situation you're going to win more than 50% of the time so cap it.

crunchy1

04-15-2005, 11:27 AM

Fish are passive, non-tricky players. The fish got the cap in on the turn and if that fish leads the river then I think there's merit to betting 4 bets in. However, that checkraise on the end should be a BIG warning siren. Fish don't play that tricky w/o the pure nuts.

meep_42

04-15-2005, 12:08 PM

A fish will never cap with a hand you beat, so you win 1 if ahead, lose 2 if behind. You need to be good 2/3s of the time to 3-bet the river. Given the read and the action, I think it's quite a bit less than that. Do you really think he's popping the Ten-high flush that hard? 2-pair? Set?

Much of the time a fish will check the turn when a flush card comes, even with a set -- this aggression is telling me that he's a moron or he's got the nuts. Personally, while there are quite a few morons out there, if that's the only way i'm ahead, i'm calling and showing down.

-d

chesspain

04-15-2005, 12:31 PM

[ QUOTE ]
don't 3 bet river

[/ QUOTE ]

private joker

04-15-2005, 01:22 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Hmm, I think you've got to cap it all the way. One one hand beats you, the nut flush and he'd to have two cards. I've seen a lot of fish cap out with trips and lower flushes and even just 2-pair.

Given you posted at all, you probably got hosed, but I think the range of hands likely in this situation you're going to win more than 50% of the time so cap it.

[/ QUOTE ]

This advice is spewery. Look at it this way: We've got the K and Q of hearts. The J is on the board. So this guy either has a T-high flush or the A-high flush. Which hand is he more likely to check-raise the river with after the turn gets capped? Do you think he can't see 3 hearts on the board? That's all fish look for -- flushes.

JoshuaD

04-15-2005, 01:26 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
don't 3 bet river

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

QTip

04-15-2005, 01:41 PM

Bison! Good to see you here! The only time I got to be in a post with you before you took off was here (http://archiveserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=1106247&page=&view=&s b=5&o=&vc=1) /images/graemlins/blush.gif

Nice post by the way...you were right. I've learned a lot since then being here, and still so much more to learn. I look forward to reading more of your posts and learning more. I see your location has you at .5/1. Are you starting from scratch and working your BR back up again?

meep_42

04-15-2005, 01:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Bison! Good to see you here! The only time I got to be in a post with you before you took off was here (http://archiveserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=1106247&page=&view=&s b=5&o=&vc=1) /images/graemlins/blush.gif

Nice post by the way...you were right. I've learned a lot since then being here, and still so much more to learn. I look forward to reading more of your posts and learning more. I see your location has you at .5/1. Are you starting from scratch and working your BR back up again?

[/ QUOTE ]

All your questions, answered... (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=1762016&page=&view=&sb=5& o=&fpart=all&vc=1)

-d

QTip

04-15-2005, 02:25 PM

Thanks for the link.

eleventy

04-15-2005, 02:31 PM

This also depends how the fish has played previous hands. Do you have any PFA #'s on him? I would probably play this the same way.