questions for posters in this forum

[beta1607]

I have some questions about the posters in this forum -

[Dead]

No
Never
Middle of the road

[jaxmike]

[ QUOTE ]
No
Never
Middle of the road

[/ QUOTE ]

Middle of the road? You have got to be kidding me. That;s the problem with leftists, they think most people think like then. If thats the case, why have they been losing consistently at the polls for over a decade?

You and your ilk are out of touch with the mainstream. Your ideas are antiquated (sp) and have been proven wrong just about EVERY time they are tried.

For you to sit here and claim that you are middle of the road is more idiotic than anything I have ever reactionarily posted on this forum.

My God have mercy on your soul.

[Dead]

I am middle of the road. The problem is that the political center has moved so far to the right, that anyone to the left of Reagan is assumed to be a liberal.

[ QUOTE ]
My God have mercy on your soul.

[/ QUOTE ]

Tell "your" God thanks for me.

[jaxmike]

[ QUOTE ]
I am middle of the road. The problem is that the political center has moved so far to the right

[/ QUOTE ]

Your ability to contradict yourself so quickly is amazing.

[kurto]

Its weird to see jax making unsupported vague generalizations. Then, after saying nothing material, asks God to have mercy on their souls.

"That;s the problem with leftists, they think most people think like then." It would be interesting to compare what positions leftists take and see how 'most people' feel about them, but Jax doesn't list any. So unlike him.

"If thats the case, why have they been losing consistently at the polls for over a decade?" On many issues, the left wins in polls. Jax makes a common logical error of confusing the results of a Presidential Election as a reflection of all issues. But then, Jax is a clown.

"You and your ilk are out of touch with the mainstream." Like... wanting cheap access to pharmaceuticals, protection of the environment, better education, protection of civil rights, affordable healthcare.... the mainstream just despises this stuff. They're so out of touch.

"Your ideas are antiquated (sp) and have been proven wrong just about EVERY time they are tried." Weird... another trite rhetorical slogan that says absolutely nothing. And this coming from Jax??!! Shocking. Notice the ideas he listed and how they've been proven wrong.

"For you to sit here and claim that you are middle of the road is more idiotic than anything I have ever reactionarily posted on this forum." In the short time I've been reading Jax, I don't know that anyone is going to believe this.

"My God have mercy on your soul." Does Jax have his own God?

[Broken Glass Can]

[ QUOTE ]
No
Never
Middle of the road

[/ QUOTE ]

If by road you mean the passing lane on a 8 lane Interstate highway.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
Like... wanting cheap access to pharmaceuticals, protection of the environment, better education, protection of civil rights, affordable healthcare....

[/ QUOTE ]

OMGawd. You must be a commie! Don't you know that the free market will take care of it?

[bholdr]

more trolls...

[jaxmike]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Like... wanting cheap access to pharmaceuticals, protection of the environment, better education, protection of civil rights, affordable healthcare....

[/ QUOTE ]

OMGawd. You must be a commie! Don't you know that the free market will take care of it?

[/ QUOTE ]

So, you claim that Conservatives dont want people to have these things? I think you are an idiot if you believe that. The DIFFERENCE is in HOW TO GO ABOUT DOING it. I don't believe the government should be paying for it, I think people should be paying for it. I don't think the government should be responsible for health care, education, and many of the other social programs that it is into. I think PEOPLE SHOULD TAKE CARE OF THEMSELVES.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
So, you claim that Conservatives dont want people to have these things?

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
I think PEOPLE SHOULD TAKE CARE OF THEMSELVES.

[/ QUOTE ]

Cognitive dissonance?

[jaxmike]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So, you claim that Conservatives dont want people to have these things?

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
I think PEOPLE SHOULD TAKE CARE OF THEMSELVES.

[/ QUOTE ]

Cognitive dissonance?

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe personal responsibility.

I wonder when that phrase will be made derogatory by the left..

[Dead]

Maybe you can tell me how expensive it is to pass and enforce a civil rights law? Are you saying that you were opposed to passing the Civil Rights Act of 1964?

[bholdr]

"Maybe personal responsibility.

I wonder when that phrase will be made derogatory by the left.. "

when people realize that many cons use it as camoflauge for "i don't wanna pay for it!"

"PEOPLE SHOULD TAKE CARE OF THEMSELVES."

i aggree. but, and, admittedly, this is an awfully broad question, but what about the people that CAN'T take care of themselves?

[Dead]

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that people who CAN work and choose not to should receive cash payments from the government.

Many times, however, the people receiving government aid are receiving it because they have no other choice. People on Medicaid and Medicare spring to mind as examples. Women and children on welfare is another.

But most people believe that the government has a role in making prescription drugs more affordable, and making our education and health care systems better. These are things that everyone benefits from, except the corporations.

[kurto]

What Jax the parrot misses is-
Jax insists that people, not the government, should pay for it. What the imp seems to forget is the government IS us, it represents us, and we are paying for whatever the government pays for.

But, there are things which are not served well in the private market. It would not be cost efficient or serve the greater good if we all have to individually pay for roads, for instance.

Medical Insurance aims to make health care more affordable so that people can get the care they need that they might not be able to afford on their own.

That's for starters.

Second, things like the Environment. Fuel Efficiency and emissions standards NEVER improved because of market forces. They improved when they were compelled to. Yet the Bush administration has weakened all forms of Environmental Regulations starting with the Clean Air Act. I don't know how Jax would suggest that we individually could better regulate industry in this area then any of us as individuals is a mystery... then again, why should he make sense now?

***************************
All this, of course, is once again off the subject. These are all issues which, according to polling, most of America SIDES with the left. The complete opposite of what the little troll stated.

We have yet to see Jax support any of his broad generalizations. My God have mercy on his soul.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
My God have mercy on his soul.

[/ QUOTE ]

Brilliant. My God does too.

Yes, it is true that a lot of Americans are socially and economically liberal. But the media and Republicans have succeeded so well in demonizing the word liberal that it has cost us elections as Democrats have tried to appeal to the centrists and right-wingers.

Republicans appeal to their base, and they win.

If we appealed to our base, we wouldn't lose the centrist vote either, and we could win as well. It seems that national Democrats are ashamed of us.

Watch Jaxmike chime in now with "as well they should be" or some other garbage, as a reply to my previous sentence.

[kurto]

"Brilliant." Don't give me credit. I'm having fun just repeating "Jaxisms." He gets all the credit!

"Yes, it is true that a lot of Americans are socially and economically liberal. But the media and Republicans have succeeded so well in demonizing the word liberal that it has cost us elections as Democrats have tried to appeal to the centrists and right-wingers." I think the reasons the Republicans have succeeded so well are numerous. Clinton was very good at countering the Right's dirty tricks division. Kerry blew at it.

The Right, as of late, has been much better organized. Contrary to the 'liberal media' BS, the left has no equivalent of the propaganda machine that the Right has. Between Fox News, Limbaugh, Talk Radio, etc., they are much better at getting their propaganda out to their flocks. If Hannity or Limbaugh or Coultier says anything, you can go to political forums and see EVERY SINGLE flamer like Jax repeat the propaganda VERBATIM. Though Moveon.org and AirAmerica may help, they are decades behind.

I also think the Right is much more brazen in appealing to the worst of their side. And the dumbest. Take this election; I believe it was in W VA. where the GOP sent out flyers to the churches saying that if Kerry won, the Bible would be banned. Which, tells you how little they think of the intelligence of their base. I would be insulted if I received something from my party that was so ludicrous. Clearly they think little of their followers.

In terms of this last election there was two interesting findings post election-
1) Many people who voted for Bush, when asked about the issues, sided with Kerry on the majority of issues, but INCORRECTLY believed they were positions held by Bush. Though let's remember, most Americans are very lazy and don't bother to look that deep. How many of them would be shocked to know they voted for the guy who represented the opposite of what they thought?
2)Kerry was prefered on a majority of issues the economy, social security, the environment, etc. Bush had only ONE area he consistantly let in the polls; national security. Hence, why we never stopped hearing Bush scaring the populace.... that's why we had Cheney implying that if Kerry was in office, there would be nuclear bombs going off over major US cities. Outside of this issue, most didn't really like Bush that much.
3) Their manipulation of the Religous Right. Hence all the meaningless blabber on social issues which really have no place in a national forum. (My father is a lifelong Republican and can't understand why any of this is being discussed. This is not traditional Republican values... which should be more libertarian in this realm.) But if they talk about Marriage and The Ten Commandments in Courthouses... which lets face it, are such insignificant issues facing our nation, but it gets the nuts they want to appeal to out to the polls.

There's more, but I'm not writing a book. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

I think the democrats need:
(1) a better candidate then Kerry. (Just as the Right can do much better the Bush.) McCain is an excellent example of a moderate Republican liked by both sides.
(2) they need to focus on the issues that they excel in. Don't let the Republicans control the debate. Focus on Education, the Economy, Healthcare, etc... issues that Kerry was easily beating Bush.
(3) Get a response team like Clinton had to respond to the endless lies and misinformation put out by the other side.

[jaxmike]

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe you can tell me how expensive it is to pass and enforce a civil rights law? Are you saying that you were opposed to passing the Civil Rights Act of 1964?

[/ QUOTE ]

Where did that come from? What did I say that could possibly make you think that?

[chabibi]

the questin was pretty clear, compare to american standards where do you stand. if you consider yourself center and everyone else in america is on the right, then by american standards you are on the left

[jaxmike]

[ QUOTE ]

Yes, it is true that a lot of Americans are socially and economically liberal. But the media and Republicans have succeeded so well in demonizing the word liberal that it has cost us elections as Democrats have tried to appeal to the centrists and right-wingers.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't really believe this? This is nonsensical jabbering. To think the MEDIA is anti-LIBERAL is insane. Democrats HAVE NOT tried to appeal to centrists and right wingers since Clinton put on the act that he was a centrist. You don't NOMINATE SOMEONE AS LIBERAL AS KERRY to appeal to the center.

[ QUOTE ]

Republicans appeal to their base, and they win.


[/ QUOTE ]

No more than liberals do, and probably no less. It just so happens that Bush was able to appeal to the people in the middle better than Kerry.

[ QUOTE ]

If we appealed to our base, we wouldn't lose the centrist vote either, and we could win as well. It seems that national Democrats are ashamed of us.

[/ QUOTE ]

No, you appeal to your base, you lose. It's been happening for over a decade. Your base is OUT OF TOUCH with the MAJORITY of the population.

[ QUOTE ]

Watch Jaxmike chime in now with "as well they should be" or some other garbage, as a reply to my previous sentence.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your party is splintered into too many factions right now. Amazingly, you have elected HOWARD DEAN as your National Chairman. He is WAY out of the mainstream, as are the major forces driving your party.

[ACPlayer]

No
Never
Right

[kurto]

You were dead on about jax jabbering response.

It was as empty as anyone would have predicted.

I wonder if there's a subject he really knows. I actually quickly searched for some poker postings by him because I was curious about his play but gave up shortly when I wasn't finding any. Which made me wonder... how did people end up on a poker forum to discuss politics? (I can understand if they mostly chatted about poker and occasionally dabbled into politics... but it seems there are a number of people here only for the politics, no? It struck me as curious.)

[CCass]

No
Often
Right

I also ran for a local office in 2002, and will do so again in 2006.

[bholdr]

yes- but i was paid very little. (it was the green party and i was broke- i soon left those whackos to their own devices)
yes- every single one (presidential- i do some stuff in the school board elections, too)
left- though i vote republican about 15-20% of the time. (shocking, huh? i voted for rob mcKenna for wash st atty gen last time, and a republican state rep, too)

[Dead]

I try not to vote Republican. The thought of voting for a right-winger makes me want to throw up in my mouth. But I will vote for a centrist/left Republican occasionally.

And I don't agree that the Green Party is full of wackos.

[Warchant88]

Dead, you'll be happy to know that I am moving slightly towards the left making me a centrist. Some of my older posts may not have seemed that way. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

For instance, I don't mind gay marriage. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]


For instance, I don't mind gay marriage. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Sean Hannity is very disappointed in you. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Warchant88]

AND I'm Catholic. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[bholdr]

the first thing i look for in any candidate i consider voting for is competence. if the democreat strikes me as incompetant, i will not vote for them- if it's really bed (such as debroah senn in wash) i will vote for the repub in order to keep that dem from screwing something important up.

Also, once in a blue moon, a republican comes along that i really like, and will vote for unless the opposition is equally qualified/ likeable/ honest, competent, etc...

I would have voted for Colin Powel or John McCain over John Kerry, for example (or would've strongly considered it anyway). instead, it was bush, which makes the descision very easy.

[kurto]

"instead, it was bush, which makes the descision very easy."

So true. My father is a lifelong Republican. He voted for Bush first term. Second term he grudgingly voted for Kerry.

The thing is... my Father, who I disagree with on so many issues, is a principled 'old school' Republican. He'll be the first to say the GOP has been hijacked. He actually likes Cheney, Rice and Powell... but he thinks Bush is just an embarrassment.

I strongly believe that 80% of Bush supporters are just partisan rubes who care more about voting for someone who calls themselves Republican then actually looking at the candidate.

A true moderate Republican who can work with both parties... McCain was the guy.

Powell was the voice of moderation in this party... so he's out.

I'm babbling, but I really have problems with anyone who can listen to Bush talk and not conclude he's a jabbering Jax.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]


I would have voted for Colin

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm disappointed in this comment.

Even after his BS at the UN in Feb 2003?

[jaxmike]

What BS exactly? The briefing he gave based on the consensus intelligence? The war that the vast majority of US Congressmen voted for continuing? What exactly did Powell do that he should be embarrassed about there???? Simply being provided flawed intelligence by the worlds intelligence communities?

[partygirluk]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
No
Never
Middle of the road

[/ QUOTE ]

Middle of the road? You have got to be kidding me. That;s the problem with leftists, they think most people think like then. If thats the case, why have they been losing consistently at the polls for over a decade?

You and your ilk are out of touch with the mainstream. Your ideas are antiquated (sp) and have been proven wrong just about EVERY time they are tried.

For you to sit here and claim that you are middle of the road is more idiotic than anything I have ever reactionarily posted on this forum.

My God have mercy on your soul.

[/ QUOTE ]

FWIW Dead has expressed views which would be considered very right wing in the UK. He does seem to be left of centre by U.S standards tho.

I don't get your point about leftists getting trashed in the polls, they lost the last Presidential election by 2% and had the most votes in the 2000 election, which suggests that the political scene in America is very balanced.

[jaxmike]

[ QUOTE ]

FWIW Dead has expressed views which would be considered very right wing in the UK. He does seem to be left of centre by U.S standards tho.

I don't get your point about leftists getting trashed in the polls, they lost the last Presidential election by 2% and had the most votes in the 2000 election, which suggests that the political scene in America is very balanced.

[/ QUOTE ]

Because they are losing ground in just about every single electable category. IE Seats in Congress, Governorships....

[beta1607]

It seems as though this thread is getting off topic...

Doesnt it strike anyone as odd and disturbing that people who have posted on this board thousands of times have never had the time or interest to volunteer in any political race, or the fact that at this point more then 80% of the respondents had volunteer seldomly or never politically?

I wonder what would have happend with a question about how often you vote.