Jane Fonda Regrets 1972 Visit to Vietnam Gun Site

[radek2166]

link (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20050331/en_nm/people_fonda_dc)

Jane Fonda Regrets 1972 Visit to Vietnam Gun Site

Thu Mar 31, 1:34 PM ET Entertainment - Reuters



NEW YORK (Reuters) - Jane Fonda regrets her visit to a North Vietnamese gun site in 1972, the actress and fitness guru said in an interview with CBS television show "60 Minutes" to be aired on Sunday.



The actress defended her trip to Vietnam in 1972, which won her the nickname "Hanoi Jane." But she said her visit to a North Vietnamese anti-aircraft gun site used to shoot down U.S. pilots was a "betrayal" of the U.S. military.


"The image of Jane Fonda, Barbarella, Henry Fonda's daughter ... sitting on an enemy aircraft gun was a betrayal," she said, calling the act, "The largest lapse of judgment that I can even imagine."


But she said she did not regret visiting Hanoi, or being photographed with American prisoners of war there.


"There are hundreds of American delegations that had met with the POWs," she said. "Both sides were using the POWs for propaganda. ... It's not something that I will apologize for."


Three decades on, Vietnam continues to be a divisive issue for Americans. During last year's election campaign, some Republican supporters of President Bush called his Democratic rival, Sen. John Kerry, "Hanoi John" for protesting the Vietnam War after fighting in it and receiving five medals for combat duty.


Why didn't they hang the bitch for treason?

[BCPVP]

I've seen this one on a few cars:
http://www.americanhonor.net/vietna3.gif

[Daliman]

What act of treason did she commit?

[DiscGolfer60]

aid and comfort to the enemy? in a documentary about p.o.w.s in the hanoi hilton, one of the prisoners gave her a note when they shook hands at the press conference(i think it was a list of names of p.o.w.s, but can't remember for sure) and she turned it over to the nva earning the p.o.w that gave her the note some extra torture for his trouble

[CCass]

Hanoi Jane can kiss my [censored] covered ass

[Dead]

Covered with cysts? Is that it?

You and Rush have something else in common. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Cyrus]

Was the war in Vietnam a just war? Was protesting against it morally legitimate?

Were war crimes on a grand scale committed by the United States at the time? Was actively sabotaging those war crimes morally correct or incorrect?

Is the credo MY COUNTRY, RIGHT OR WRONG still valid in the 20th century? Note that it's the same century that saw the Nuremberg Trials, where the Allies legislated that moral judgement supercedes military discipline or patriotism (i.e. you are guilty of a war crime if you machine gun a bunch of enemy civilians, even if your officer ordered you to, or your country demands it of you)

Answer those questions first, people, and then answer the question in the tile of this post. Try to be consistent.

[BCPVP]

[ QUOTE ]
Clause 1: Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.

[/ QUOTE ]

[sirio11]

Has the US already offered an apology for all the atrocities commited by American Soldiers to Vietnamese people in that war?

[Cyrus]

[ QUOTE ]
Clause 1: Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.

[/ QUOTE ]

As empty of content as any non-answer I've ever seen. So thanks for nothing.

!?! (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=2052185&page=191&view =expanded&sb=6&o=&vc=1)

[Toro]

Back in the day, I was anti Vietnam War but always thought that what Fonda did was stupid and hurt the anti war cause.

Now she comes out with this non apology apology. Does she think after all these years she can actually rehabititate her image with people who still despise her?

[BCPVP]

Frankly Cyrus, I don't think you're questions are important if we're discussing whether what Fonda did was treason and whether or not this apology was sincere.

[andyfox]

Why Americans would be angrier at Jane Fonda than at its leaders who murdered and lied about it has always amazed me. I was at Dodger Stadium the night Richard Nixon died, and he got a minute of reverent silence and then five presidents at his funeral and Bob Dole crying for him. But Jane Fonda, the bitch, should be shot.

Strange planet.

[Drunk Bob]

Right blame Nixon. How about FDR,Truman,IKE,JFK and LBJ.

[trippin bily]

who got the US out of the vietnam war???

[sirio11]

[ QUOTE ]
Why Americans would be angrier at Jane Fonda than at its leaders who murdered and lied about it has always amazed me. I was at Dodger Stadium the night Richard Nixon died, and he got a minute of reverent silence and then five presidents at his funeral and Bob Dole crying for him. But Jane Fonda, the bitch, should be shot.

Strange planet.

[/ QUOTE ]

The same reason some nuts are angrier at Michael Moore than Bush.

Yep, a very strange planet indeed.

[BCPVP]

I didn't know it was strange to hate traitors...

[andyfox]

Yes, there's plenty of blame to go around, just so happens I remember the death of Nixon from my Dodger Stadium experience.

[andyfox]

Nixon got the U.S. out of the Vietnam War in the same sense that Hitler got the Germans out of World War II. He lost it. And he intended to go back in and bomb the hell out of Vietnam, possibly with nukes, after the North violated the peace agreement. Meanwhile, he bombed away at civilians, relishing the fact that the Communists might consider him a psychotic. Quite a "secret" policy to get us out of the war.

How many people died from 1969 to 1974 when he signed a peace agreement on the exact same terms that the Communists had offered in 1969? This after Nixon sabotaged the peace meetings being held in 1968, a probable act of treason.

And people hate Jane Fonda for what she did during Vietnam.

[andyfox]

It's not. That's why Richard Nixon and Lyndon Johnson, who were murderous traitors, should be hated for their actions, not Jane Fonda, who was merely a well-publicized actress who opposed the murder.

Anyone who reads The Pentagon Papers and/or Hitchens' The Trial of Henry Kissinger and is still worried about Jane Fonda's shortcomings has a warped sense of reality.

[ThaSaltCracka]

[ QUOTE ]
who got the US out of the vietnam war???

[/ QUOTE ]and got us into Cambodia and Laos.

Nixon had a awful mess to clean up after LBJ(the POS) [censored] everything up, but still Nixon was no saint in Vietnam. Still a helluva president.

[BCPVP]

What Jane Fonda did was definitely treason.

What Nixon and LBJ did was debateable.

There's really no debate about what Fonda did.

[Dead]

I agree.

She stepped over the line with her actions. Simply opposing the war was fine, but cavorting with the VC and helping to injure our troops is a different matter entirely.

[BCPVP]

Which is why many Vietnam vets as well as others will not forgive her. We can tolerate protestors, but not traitors.

[Dead]

I don't think a lot of Republicans tolerate protesters either. We're anti-American, according to Hannity.

We don't "appreciate" what this fine country has to offer.

[BCPVP]

"Anti-American"? No.
Misguided? Yes /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[andyfox]

You're missing my point, I'm probably not being clear.

Let's assume you're correct about Fonda. The severity and importance of her "crimes" disappear in comparison with the enormity of those of Nixon and LBJ which are not in any way debatable. The facts have been obscured by the haze of lies perpetrated by apologists, but a reading of, for example, the government's own Pentagon Papers, points out the enormity of the horror perpetrated by our own government.

Which is more reprehensible: the rantings of a famous movie actress, or a government that dropped more bombs on South Vietnam, the "country" we were supposed to be defending, than were dropped by all combatants in all of World War II? Posing with North Vietnamese anti-aircraft weapons or the Phoenix assassinations and the craterization of the landscape of an entire country?

What does it say about us when we want to shoot the bitch but give Nixon a hero's funeral?

[andyfox]

What about war criminals?

[zaxx19]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think a lot of Republicans tolerate protesters either. We're anti-American, according to Hannity.

[/ QUOTE ]


When you studied those word lists, to get a 23 on the ACT and skate into whatever mediocre public institution you skated into, didnt you learn what the word "TOLERATE" meant??

Apparently not. /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[BCPVP]

[ QUOTE ]
You're missing my point, I'm probably not being clear.


[/ QUOTE ]
No, I understand completely. I just don't agree.

I'm not defending what LBJ and Nixon did. I'm just saying that in American culture, we tend to have the utmost spite for people we feel are traitors. Hell, we've coined metaphors out of traitors (read Benedict Arnold). That's my point. How severe you view what LBJ and Nixon did is not universal. How we view Fonda's actions seem to be relatively universal.

[elwoodblues]

[ QUOTE ]
Hell, we've coined metaphors out of traitors (read Benedict Arnold).

[/ QUOTE ]

What's with the plurals?
That's the only one I can think of...you got any more?

[BCPVP]

At least two if you count Fonda! /images/graemlins/tongue.gif /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[tolbiny]

Mcarthyism.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't think a lot of Republicans tolerate protesters either. We're anti-American, according to Hannity.

[/ QUOTE ]


When you studied those word lists, to get a 23 on the ACT and skate into whatever mediocre public institution you skated into, didnt you learn what the word "TOLERATE" meant??

Apparently not. /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Zaxx, are you a functional illiterate?

I never took the ACT, and I don't know what my SAT score would convert to on that scale, not that I give a [censored]. And I didn't study any word lists- I didn't study for the SAT.

I imagine that most people who read your posts conclude that you are an idiot who tries to impress people by talking about poker players that you like and other bullshit.

And I'm not at a mediocre public institution. I'm at a very good public institution. So go [censored] yourself.

And I borrowed the word tolerate from BCPVP's post. Tool.

[zaxx19]

[ QUOTE ]
Zaxx, are you a functional illiterate?


[/ QUOTE ]

I may be functionally illiterate....probably not a functionally illiterate.

[ QUOTE ]
I never took the ACT

[/ QUOTE ]

Im guessing the folks over at the college board arent weeping over that one.

[ QUOTE ]
I imagine that most people who read your posts conclude that you are an idiot who tries to impress people by talking about poker players that you like and other bullshit.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes almost all of my posts include comments about my favorite poker player Barry "GO ILLINI" Greenstein...

[ QUOTE ]
And I'm not at a mediocre public institution. I'm at a very good public institution

[/ QUOTE ]

Dont shortchange your school, its very mediocre if it admitted you.

[ QUOTE ]
And I borrowed the word tolerate from BCPVP's post.

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course that has nothing to do with whether you understand the words meaning...but keep writing as I find your rambling incohherence quite entertaining.

[Dead]

It's is not the same as its.

And learn to spell.

I cannot believe I am being lectured about intelligence by the likes of you. Please, cut it out.

[zaxx19]

Why not?

Im smarter than you.

[Dead]

That much is obvious, Zaxx.

You almost certainly have a larger penis as well.

Are you happy now? Or do you need your ego stroked some more? /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[andyfox]

Fair enough. Unlike poker, then, in poltics sometimes money walks and bullshi*t talks. My point it that for people to feel more anger at Fonda than at Nixon and LBJ shows the power of the powers that be to get away with The Big Lie, even in a democracy.