My Poker Resume OR What level should I be playing at?

[pokerstudAA]

It is time to examine my poker game. I have some leaks. I wont post any boring PT stats or anything - more like meta-game issues. I appreciate any helpful advice.


Sorry if this is long.


I have been playing real money online poker for 10 months - since last May, I started with $50 at Party and ran it up to $400 playing .5/1 and $5 or $10 SNG's. Realizing there was more to this online poker thing than meets the eye, I got serious. Read most of the the 2+2 library along with other books - some a few times.


LIMIT POKER

Started with .5/1 - played several thousand hands pre-PT.
I will try to limit the details but if any would be helpful let me know.

.5/1 - 15,809 hands - 21% VP/8.5 PFR 4.5BB/100

1/2 - 10,908 hands - 15% VP/ 7% PFR 2.2BB/100

2/4 - 12,173 hands - 15% VP/7.6 % PFR 1.3 BB/100


5/10 - 16,700 Hands - 16.8% VP/ 8.4% PFR 0.6 BB/100

10/20 - 2,400 hands - 15.5% VP/ 7.8% PFR 0.9 BB/100
INSERT (too small sample disclaimer)

I have played 94 hands of 15/30 for kicks. Also a few thousand of 1/2 6max and a few hundred of 5/10 6max. 5/10 6max might not be a bad next stop.

I only have 650 hands at 3/6 but largely skipped it to play in 5/10 - I thought the bankroll could make it at 5/10 and wanted to make a little more cheese. I am sure I could have used 15,000+ hands at 3/6 but decided to go to 5/10 after a big MTT cash.


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TOTAL LIMIT (all levels) - 59,968 hands 2.1 BB/100

I think I might be a winning player, and I am begining to get comfortable with 5/10 but I am not winning much at this level. FWIW - after 10,000 I was 1.2BB/100. I would like to keep enough in the roll to stay at 5/10 but I will move down if necessary.

SNG's

Started with the $5 until I learned about the bad rake structure. Played mabye 100 $5 and $10 SNG's pre-PT. Here is the post-PT numbers:

$5 - 50 [ ROI/ITM] -10 1st, 8 2nds, 6 3rds.

$10 - 251 games [15% ROI/32%ITM] - 36 1sts,26 2nds, 28 3rds

$20 - 70 played [53% ROI/46% ITM] - 16 1sts, 6 2nds, 10 3rds

$30 - 25 [ -5% ROI/ITM]. Dont think I want to play higher than this in the SNG's. More SNG's probably would help my final table MTT play (good investment).

$50 - 2 - one 2nd place


MTT's
Started playing the $5's when the bankroll was low. Picked up a 4th in a 2000 person for $700. Got a 1st in a 2000 - for an even $2000.

Played the 10's, 20's - not many of theses

Started playing in the $30 - with about 700-800 people. I picked up money spots with regularity in theses. Sevel finishes in the top 60, 50, 40, a few 20's, a 13th, and one 2nd in a 790 person for $2800.

I have played about 50 of the three table tourneys at the $5-$30 levels. No good records of these (PT's sole achilies) but satisfactory results (+EV).

I want to keep playing MTT's but they take sooo much time and are not always convenient. I want to start playing some of the bigger buy in tournaments. All entry fees need to come from the bankroll.


TILT FACTOR: LOW
Tends to tilt of rest of chips after bad beats in MTT's. Limit tilt may be existent - usually I take a break to refocus.

POKER EDUCATION (otherwise known as my bookshelf)
Started with Hold em' for Advanced Players and have read nearly everything interesting out there. F-it. Let me check the books. Here we go.....in no particular order...Killing online poker, Inside the Poker Mind, Killer Holdem Handbook, Hold em; Poker - Gary Carson (good one), Tao of Poker, Small Stakes Hold 'em (great 2-3 times), Psychology of Poker, Championship NL + Pot limit, Harrington on Hold em(5 stars - reading it again) - I have given a few away also to all my fishy friends. Also spend some time on these message boards trying to learn.

BANKROLL
About 6k. I might like to take 2-3 out for personal expenses. Recently hooked up Netteller. I need enough to play what ever limit I decide on and enough to play a large number of MTT's (30's 50's mabye more). How much should I keep in my bankroll? I never want to go to pocket.

WEB SITES
Play at Party. No rake back - sucks - will have it soon. Need new account probably Poker Now with rake back. Might try Poker Stars or Empire. Need a new name to go undercover from all the data miners out there.

GOALS:
I am trying to get as good as this game as I can. What ever limit or games I play at need to be within my roll and need to provide me with a good amount of monthly available funds. MTT's are time consuming and streaky.


Where do I go from here......What is the plan of attack?

I need some advice with:

1) Limit Level.
2) MTT Level.
3) Bankroll requirements.
4) Any thing else you can think of.

[Scotch78]

A little more info might help . . . how much monthly income are you looking for? How many tables and hands per week do you play?

Scott

[pokerstudAA]

I am not really concerned about a particular monthly income. I would like to take some money out after any large tourney cash to spend on cool gear. 2K every month might be a good number to achieve

I want to maximize the monthly bankroll growth based on the bankroll size and my skill level (whatever that might be).

I probably can commit 5 hours to MTT's on at least 2 or 3 nights a week. 2-3 hours a day of limit on other days.

[Robk]

limit advice:
i see no strong evidence you can beat anything above a 1-2 game. if i were you id play 2-4 and see how it goes.

mtt advice:
im not really qualified.

bankroll advice:
withdrawing 2-3k puts you in a spot where a bad run can knock you down in limits. id keep it all in there if plan to continue dabbling in games above 3-6.

other advice:
reread hpfap, ssh.

[TStoneMBD]

60k hands should be enoug to determine if you are a winning player or not. you look fine. your bankroll is 6k so dont go over 10/20. if you can beat 10/20 for a BB/hr, you can build up your roll to 9k in no time to hit 15/30. 10/20 is no more difficult than 5/10 so you should do well. listen to conventional wisdom about not jumping above your bankroll.

[Robk]

[ QUOTE ]
60k hands should be enoug to determine if you are a winning player or not. you look fine. your bankroll is 6k so dont go over 10/20.

[/ QUOTE ]

look carefully. he has 18000 hands above 2/4, with a winrate < 1 bb/100. this is dangerous advice.

[JinX11]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
60k hands should be enoug to determine if you are a winning player or not. you look fine. your bankroll is 6k so dont go over 10/20.

[/ QUOTE ]

look carefully. he has 18000 hands above 2/4, with a winrate < 1 bb/100. this is dangerous advice.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm going to have to concur here.

I'd like to see OP play more at 2/4, achieving >2.5BB/100 over a good number of hands before tackling 5/10 or 10/20 full time. I think throwing in some 3/6 is a good idea, as well; while it is not terribly different than 2/4, there are enough differences (aggression, players seeing flop) to warrant a stop. OP also needs to be mentally prepared for the inevitable bad run at higher limits; easing into each higher limit to get used to game while dropping back to replenish the bankroll might be the right idea. I do believe each limit poses some different challenges.

My belief is that PP 2/4 can be beaten in excess of 3 BB/100 by a good player. I'm beating 2/4 for more than this over 80K hands and I'm reminded on a regular basis of how bad I am at this game (e.g., each time I move up to 5/10).

[Isura]

Agree. OP seems to be a solid player, but if he hits a bad run at 5/10 or 10/20 it could have a serious effect on his own confidence. He might attribute the lossses to poor play instead of variance. I think it takes experience to decide whether a large losing streak is due to bad cards or poor play (usually both /images/graemlins/frown.gif). Hitting your first bad swing at 2/4 will be much less painful both financially and psychologically. G

[PokerAce]

Please, please, PLEASE play more hands at each limit before moving up. With < 20k hands, you have no idea if you're beating the limit or just getting lucky.

I made the same mistake as you did. After an incredible run after moving up to 2/4 (doubled my $1400 bankroll in less than a week), I jumped around the limits like you are. I played 3/6, 5/10, 5/10 6-max, and 10/20. I had my bankroll up over $4,000 even after withdrawing $1,800. All this occurred over a three week period (tons of hands played). In the fourth week, my bankroll was down to $2,400. A month later, it was at $1,800.

The first drop was due to overplaying my bankroll. After that, I stuck to playing 3/6, which I was adequately bankrolled for. The last drop was due to an incredible streak of bad luck.

I've since turned things around, and my bankroll is now a little over $3,000. I will not move up until I get a 400 BB for 5/10. I would recommend that you drop down to at least 2/4, if not 1/2. After another 15k-20k hands, move up to 3/6. Play 20k-30k hands at 3/6 before moving up. Rinse and repeat. Don't move up until you hit 400 BB and are beating your current limit for at least 1 BB/100.

That's what I'm doing. Incidently, if you're interested, I'm documenting my progression through the limits in my blog, which you can check out by viewing my profile.

Oh, and definitely get a rakeback deal. I have a very good Empire affiliate who has been very responsive and reliable. PM me and I'll hook you up with him if you're interested. I pay over $2k in rake each month. It's very much worth getting some of that back.