Ethical Question

[KenProspero]

Single table 7-card stud (low stakes -- actually play chips when it happened, but the other person says he's done this in money games too).

Three left in the game. Two with relatively even stacks, and a third who hasn't made a bet other than bring-ins and ante's in 40 or 50 hands, and is obviously 'not playing'.

One of the two players says -- 'let's just check everything until there's just the two of us'.

Collusion, obviously.

Ethical??

[DrPhysic]

Absolutely NO.

You can DO it, but you can't SAY it.

Doc

[KenProspero]

And when someone else says it?

[DrPhysic]

Since you say "single table" I am assuming you are in a tournament or sng. Therefore getting up and finding another table is probably not an option.

I would ignore it, as if you had not heard it or had chat turned off online. You probably don't want to be the one that called the floorperson to report it, and you certainly don't want to get into a discussion of table ethics while you are playing which would tend to involve you in the situation. Online, I would turn chat off and play my own game, if finding another table was not an option.

I am by no means a cardtable lawyer. Others may have more knowledge or experience in how this should be handled.

Doc

[Mez]

I wouldn't say this is 'cheating', but its a gray area. I once was in a SNG when my hard drive crashed, I had to re-assemble another computer, download PP via dial-up and get back on the table. When I left it was 9 handed, I came back to 4 handed play.

I've seen some players come-and-go, I believe some do try to cheat by sitting out and hoping they place ITM as others play their normal game. I think that's much worse than splitting the stack of the absentee player.

[Grivan]

[ QUOTE ]
I've seen some players come-and-go, I believe some do try to cheat by sitting out and hoping they place ITM as others play their normal game. I think that's much worse than splitting the stack of the absentee player.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't see why this is bad... If it is profitable there is no reason why a person should not sit out.

[rjb03]

Sitting out while on top of a large stack is not cheating. It's not exactly smart either as you can steal more often on the bubble.

[housenuts]

if the big stack wants to sit out i'm all for it. i dont' think it's cheating either. what's the difference if he played but just folded every hand? this is just more convenient

[Grivan]

[ QUOTE ]
Sitting out while on top of a large stack is not cheating. It's not exactly smart either as you can steal more often on the bubble.

[/ QUOTE ]

Obviously for most players sitting out is not the most profitable line, but for some truly horrendous players it might be.

[KenProspero]

If say ..... ummmmm ...... your boss calls in the middle of an SnG, blinding out may be the ONLY strategy, since the negative ev of losing your job almost surely exceeds your equity in the game.

[Grivan]

Outside forces are not in question here. We were talkin about sitting out as a strategy when you are able to play. Obviously if you only have the option of sitting out that is what you are going to do. Also, you shouldn't be playing poker while you are at work. I am pretty sure your boss does not pay you to be playing poker.

[ethan]

[ QUOTE ]
I once was in a SNG when my hard drive crashed, I had to re-assemble another computer, download PP via dial-up and get back on the table. When I left it was 9 handed, I came back to 4 handed play.


[/ QUOTE ]

1337.

Seriously, that's pretty classy. Well done.

[KenProspero]

Grivan

I was trying to make a light comment here (though my boss does know I sometimes try to sneak in some play at lunch, and doesn't mind).

In any event, I don't think 'blinding out' is cheating, for the same reasons I don't think playing ultra tight with a small stack on the bubble is cheating.

When I started this thread it was try to get input as to how one should respond when someone affirmatively suggests checking in collusion to knock out the person who was has left the table and is 'blinding'/'ante-ing' out. It's something that comes up in low stakes SnGs, and is particularly a problem in 7-card stud, where the combination of antes and bring-ins can be much less than blinds in hold-em.