Is my "any two" threshold too low?

jon_1van · #1 05-18-2005, 11:26 PM

All hand Party 10+1s
It is just freakish coincidence that I'm on the BB each time

Hand 1 ::

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t300 (5 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

UTG (t750)
MP (t1840)
Button (t2010)
SB (t2260)
Hero (t1140)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
3 folds, SB raises to t600, Hero raises to t840, SB calls t540

Flop: (t1440) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)

Turn: (t1440) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)

River: (t1440) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)

Final Pot: t1440

Hand 2 :: in 2 hands we will be at 50/100 level

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (6 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

Button (t820)
SB (t2610)
Hero (t365)
UTG (t1795)
MP (t715)
CO (t1695)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls t50, 1 fold, CO raises to t125, Hero raises to t315, 3 folds, CO calls t240.

Flop: (t490) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)

Turn: (t490) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)

River: (t490) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)

Final Pot: t490

Hand 3 ::

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (7 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

Hero (t1160)
UTG (t305)
MP1 (t1025)
MP2 (t915)
CO (t1100)
Button (t1405)
SB (t2090)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls t100, 3 folds, Button raises to t400, Hero raises to t1060, 2 folds, Button calls t760.

Flop: (t1410) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)

Turn: (t1410) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)

River: (t1410) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)

Final Pot: t1410

Maulik · #2 05-18-2005, 11:34 PM

first example, its only ~t250 for him to call, you have NO FE whatsoever. clearly a fold.

second, with the blinds being t50, you can fold this and push any two next hand. do that, bad call

three, played correctly

gumpzilla · #3 05-18-2005, 11:40 PM

I'll start from clearest in my mind to murkiest.

I don't like Hand 2. There's been a limper and a raise, and you do not have enough chips to realistically fold the raiser (he's going to be getting something close to 3:1). Your holding is going to play pretty poorly heads up. You can afford to fold this and use your 6 BBs in a better spot (folded to in the CO or button, for example). (EDIT: I missed the blinds were going up in two hands. This does make a call somewhat better here. That said, since you'll be through the blinds, you'll at least have a few spots to choose from. I think the key is that 54 is just rough heads up. With 2.5 BBs I think you'll have just enough oomph to isolate against a BB, and you can probably do so with a better heads up hand than 54. This is much closer than I originally thought though, I'm glad I reread.)

Hand 3 depends somewhat on how button has been playing. If he's been really, REALLY tight, then this is somewhat worrying and I might consider folding, but otherwise this is too much hand for this situation. There are two possible plays: push now, or stop and go. You are too short to call and check-fold, so if you call you should plan on pushing any flop. I think pushing now is probably fine in this situation, though this is a fairly good place to try the stop and go. So I think your play here is okay against most low level opponents.

Hand 1 is pretty rough. Folding leaves you with just over 2 BBs after you post the SB next hand, which means no folding equity. I think you're probably right to just gamble here with what are likely two live cards rather than hope for a better spot, because even if you found one doubling up wouldn't cure all of your problems if you lost more stack. So I think this was a good move as well.

So, except for Hand 2, I like it.

Moonsugar · #4 05-18-2005, 11:55 PM

There is a HUGE difference between raising first in with any 2 and reraising with any 2.

BradleyT · #5 05-19-2005, 01:12 AM

[ QUOTE ]
There is a HUGE difference between raising first in with any 2 and reraising with any 2.

[/ QUOTE ]

jon_1van · #6 05-19-2005, 01:49 AM

So I agree now that hand 2 is complete crap.

But for hand 1, are you sure I should fold after putting in a little more than a quarter of my stack in blinds to then put another 17% of my stack in the next hand on the SB. If I fold both of these hands I will only have aboout 2 BB left.

P.S. I hand corrected a bug in the converter...it was actually another 500 for him to call. But that probably doesn't make a difference

Newt_Buggs · #7 05-19-2005, 03:01 AM

I'm very curious about hand 1 because I don't know the answer to this one when I really should. It seems to me like pushing here sucks, but you're kind of screwed either way. If you fold you have almost no FE and will probably end up gambling with a hand thats not much better. Besides, 68s beats AKo 41% of the time which means that as long as you aren't dominated, which is probably true, you pretty much have odds to call this. If I'm missing something please correct me, but I think that I would push this and get ready to open up another table.

beeyjay · #8 05-19-2005, 03:12 AM

the "any two" pushing requirements discussed on this board are by and large limited to situations where you are opening the pot. I read thru all these examples a little quickly but just the part about you being in the BB in all of them and other action happening before its your turn to act make me think the first 2 hands are probably misplayed. Hand 3 looks at least fairly standard to me.

Overall you want to open the pot with any two. If somebody already called and youre short stacked you're proabbly gettin called and you better be ready to beat a good hand.