call this an Angle Shoot? Long.

[Zetack]

I was playing in a home game that was a bit of a card room set up. Dealer was not playing and was raking the game. I'm not even sure how much the rake was, but it was a pretty juicy game (I made 197 big blinds--although I was running pretty well) when this situation came up.

Nine handed, 1/2 NL. (We might have been down to 8 handed at that point).

Player A at the opposite end of the table from me, seemed to be steaming a bit, although I didn't see anything obvious to put him on tilt. So he starts jawing with the guy next to him on his right (in a good natured way though) about going all-in blind. The guy to his right says he's up for it and they talk about it. When it gets to righty though, he folds. Player A says hey, I thought we were going all-in and righty says that player A needs to commit to it before the action gets to him.

Player A then says, All-in! (For $179). I mutter to the guy on my right (Player PO) who I've been friendly with (and beating up on) all night, "man, I'd call with just about anything decent."

PO asks a couple of times you haven't looked at your cards? Player A never answers but the guys to both his left and right say that he hasn't. PO calls and turns over A-4 off. Player A turns over A-K and wins the pot.

PO immediately starts steaming and keeps telling me that player A looked at his cards before going all in, that he saw him do it. I was pretty skeptical because I didn't see him do that, both of the other guys said he hadn't, and whatthe hell was PO doing if he saw player A do that.

PO pays off the hand mostly in cash out of his pocket so he still has his chips in front of him and immediately starts jawing at player A to go all in blind again. Player A says he will but when the action gets to him he just limps. "What's going on?" asks PO. "I've got to see the rest of the action, its got to be just the two of us," says A.

Everyboy folds to PO on the button, who agrees, its gotta be just the two of us. So I fold the SB and the BB folds too, both of us out of turn so those guys can go heads up all-in blind.

PO then says all in, counts out his chips and flips over 3-9 suited. A picks up his cards, laughs, and says, I've got the ace, and turns his cards face up in front of him. A-rag off.

PO is now really unhappy, the dealer burns one and flips three, and one of the three is a nine. PO starts to celebrate as the table erupts.

At that point player A says: "I never called!"

Dealer deals the rest of the cards as the two argue about it and the nines hold up.

Player A continued to maintain he never called. He never paid up and the game broke up to much acrimony.


Thoughts?


--Zetack

[Khabbi]

Definately angle shooting. He never did call, so he's got an argument. Although, if the pot was pushed to him, he wouldn't have brought up the point.

[Richard Tanner]

The problem here, and this is the angle shoot, is that you've let your neighbor get put into a no-win situation (not "you" in the sense that you did it, you get the point).
As the poster above me said, if the pot were pushed to him, he would'nt have said anything, only when he loses will he speak up, thus the rightful winner can never win.
You say this is an underground game..hmmm...well kicking the [censored] out of him isn't an option unless you want the cops called, so sadly you'll just have to placate this assbag and leave it up to the host to compensate the agrieved player.


Cody

[Lottery Larry]

PO is an idiot.. TWICE in a ROW This is mostly his fault, he deserved it.

Player A seems to be angle shooting and is an ass. Don't play with him.

[EStreet20]

Definitely an angle shoot, but it's the dealer's fault for dealing the flop without hearing a verbal call from player A.

[smoore]

Angle.

[adman2006]

he's ruined a nice home game atmosphere. Get rid of him or the home game dies. easy decision really

[tonypaladino]

[ QUOTE ]
Angle.

[/ QUOTE ]

[Zetack]

[ QUOTE ]
The problem here, and this is the angle shoot, is that you've let your neighbor get put into a no-win situation (not "you" in the sense that you did it, you get the point).
As the poster above me said, if the pot were pushed to him, he would'nt have said anything, only when he loses will he speak up, thus the rightful winner can never win.
You say this is an underground game..hmmm...well kicking the [censored] out of him isn't an option unless you want the cops called, so sadly you'll just have to placate this assbag and leave it up to the host to compensate the agrieved player.


Cody

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, its too bad the host didn't step up, he seems to be pulling enough from this game (somewhere around 390 bucks from the pre-cash game tourney, and a pretty healthy rake from the cash game) I was really disapointed that at the very least he didn't tell the guy he wasn't welcome to play here ever again.

His remedy? Well he came out and told a few of us who were standing around griping that he told the guy, "look, when you flip your cards over like that, make sure you say "I am not calling, lets just run them out for fun."" Yeah, like that'll work on an angle shooter.

Afterwards, one of the guys next to him said that player A definitely did look at his cards in the first hand and saw that he had A-K before he went all-in "blind". So he's really just all-round scum.

--Zetack

[henrikrh]

You say this is a cardroom atmosphere? You gotta get your players under control and make everything friendlier while sitll enforcing the rules. How can player A possibly claim he never called if you had been running the game correctly? Either his money is in the pot before the cards start being turned over or he isn't in the hand. I wouldn't play in this sketchy game.