PP NL 600 Set of Q's facing an ugly board.

BadVoodooX · #1 07-05-2005, 02:43 AM

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (7 handed) converter

SB ($404.5)
BB ($696.75)
UTG ($859.3)
MP1 ($582)
MP2 ($963.25)
Hero ($754.6)
Button($712.5)

Preflop: Hero is LP with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $3.
2 folds, MP2 calls $6, 1 fold, Hero raises to $24, Button calls $24, SB calls $24, BB calls $18, MP2 folds.

Button is quite LAG, but usually makes moves his big moves on river or aginst hands that haven't shown a lot of stregth. Assumed that SB & BB have either runners or small pair.

Flop: ($78) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $50, SB calls $50, BB folds.

Turn: ($178) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $150, Button raises to $350

Hero?

Comments on all streets.

Morphling29 · #2 07-05-2005, 02:56 AM

I like every street, I would move in on the turn. The only hands I am afraid or are AJ hearts, slowplayed KK, possibly J9 heats, I will live with those beats plus you have redraw.

technologic · #3 07-05-2005, 03:51 AM

i'm a little confused as to the action.

on the flop it says sb calls, but the turn says button bets and it's 2 handed. did button call the original bet and sb and bb fold?

i'd bet a bit more on the flop, to price obvious draws as much as possible. you showed strength pf, they know you have a hand, and if they have a draw, you'll want to price them as much as possible on that kind of a board.

the turn i'd stick it in there to make him show me that AJ or J9.

savman · #4 07-05-2005, 04:03 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (7 handed) converter

SB ($404.5)
BB ($696.75)
UTG ($859.3)
MP1 ($582)
MP2 ($963.25)
Hero ($754.6)
Button($712.5)

Preflop: Hero is LP with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $3.
2 folds, MP2 calls $6, 1 fold, Hero raises to $24, Button calls $24, SB calls $24, BB calls $18, MP2 folds.

Button is quite LAG, but usually makes moves his big moves on river or aginst hands that haven't shown a lot of stregth. Assumed that SB & BB have either runners or small pair.

Flop: ($78) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $50, SB calls $50, BB folds.

Turn: ($178) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $150, Button raises to $350

Hero?

Comments on all streets.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dont see how villain is giving us credit for a set. LAG could easily be doing this with with Ax hearts, kq, whatever...1010 may have just got there, i mean we didnt show real strength on the flop, and he may have been planning on making a move on the pot...my range for villain is fairly large and we are really only afraid of AJ or J9hearts....i dont see KKK much here as i think we would have heard from LAG at somepoint, i mean he is LAG he is supposed to raise, he could bump the pot on two earlier streets and expect to get action, IMO.

i think we have to shove on the turn, calling pot committs us anyway and i just dont think we are behind enough times here to fold. I mean we are dealing with a LAG who has position, not a rock. If we are behind, we can always river quads baby!

BadVoodooX · #5 07-05-2005, 04:08 AM

The converter did some funky stuff with position of people on this one and tried to manually fix it but I missed the part you noticed.

My concern is the turn where I've obviously got at least a pair and in this position, quite possibly top 2 or a very big set and he's raising me after a healthy bet on the turn. There just aren't that many hands that he will put me on that I'm likely to fold so I pretty much have to assume he thinks he's ahead and is value betting. The question is whether he's right or not.

An extra $10-20 on the flop would have been fine, I randomly vary my bet sizes between 50-110% of the pot in situations like this and that's where the # game out.

Ulysses · #6 07-05-2005, 04:46 AM

That was not the board I was expecting to see when I clicked on the thread. Stick the rest of your money in there and either win or lose, then move on to the next hand.

fimbulwinter · #7 07-05-2005, 05:10 AM

[ QUOTE ]
That was not the board I was expecting to see when I clicked on the thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is what i thought when i clicked this thread. really, there are a few 2nd best hands the T makes, very few better ones (all of which give you redraws) and one hand which had you crushed on the flop. I suspect a push has a very good chance of getting called by a hand drawing stone cold dead.

fim

VanVeen · #8 07-05-2005, 05:22 AM

You have no other option but to shove all your money in there. You're playing against a player whose turn raising range is wider than your typical player's and all you've done is bet two streets. If he can conclude from a flop bet and turn bet that you're often holding a set, two pair, or some other monster you'll never fold then you're doing something very wrong (and he's unusually observant for a 600nl player).

Folding is ludicrous and so is calling and leading if the board pairs or check-calling (FOLDING??) if it doesn't. Those aren't viable alternatives to shoving for obv. reasons.

Niwa · #9 07-05-2005, 05:26 AM

Bet 80ish on flop.
Reads on any of the players?

I dont see why you wouldnt get it all-in.

spoohunter · #10 07-05-2005, 02:14 PM

I would have bet atleast the pot on that draw heavy flop, but whats so ugly about this board?

The turn is an easy push, and if he hit his gutshot, well, that's what's fun about being LAG, you get paid off well.