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#42
04-30-2005, 10:08 PM
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Re: Poll: IQ
most people who answered this thread are full of [censored].
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#43
05-01-2005, 01:51 PM
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Re: Poll: IQ
What about differences b/w speed thinking and untimed? Would you assume that people who do better at the speed tests are better poker players than those who excel at untimed tests? My IQ scores on this International Society of People who have Too Much Time on Their Hands ranged from 118 - 148, with the 118 on the 12 min test and the high score on an untimed. I am also much better at untimed chess than speed chess (I have a friend who beats me almost 100% of the time at speed chess, while I beat him 100% of the time at untimed). Would I be a better poker player if I could think faster?
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#45
05-01-2005, 02:29 PM
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Re: Poll: IQ
Good post okee.
I have taught College Physics with 100+ students in the class and your comment about slower thinkers not necessarily behind quicker thinkers in intelligence I think can be accurate for individuals. I would say that on average, over thousands of people, the quicker a person can go through a test, the more intelligent, or more practiced they are at the subject. But there are individual variances on this. Some Physics students comming into the test did all the extra practice problems in order to prepare. They see a new question and it is similar enough to a question they have already seen that they can do it faster. The other student may not have as huge a database in his mind, but knows the concepts of physics well enough to figure the answer out. Essentially he gets bored memorizing every possible twist of how to figure out an object's acceleration for example. He gets to the point where he knows he has enough understaning to figure out different situations and cracks open a beer. Since he's thinking through it more methodically, he may actually have more insight than the person who is pattern recing the question. I would spend class time preparing students for the MCAT test (medical school students sometimes have the toughest time on the physics portion of the test you need to take before going to medical school). Knowing the concepts in the course is not enough to prepare - you need to practice and get a feel for the kinds of questions that happen on these tests. And I would give practice tests and time the students. Sometimes they would be suprised at how little time they had to finish, but that is part of the preperation. As to poker, there is one site now (Paradise) that has a "think tank" additional time in tournaments. So once you go beyond your normal 25 seconds you tap into this pool of time. As you use this extra time it counts down. So if you have an all in decision at a critical point in the tournament you do have a some extra time to think about the situation. I think this is an excellent idea and hope that other sites also pick up on this. There have been many times, particularly in tournaments, where I wish I had that think tank.
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#46
05-02-2005, 01:08 AM
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Re: Poll: IQ
Wow. If Stanford only had as fine a recruiting staff as Sklansky...
How about a follow up post asking how much above or below the average 2+2 IQ people think they are.
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#47
05-02-2005, 01:32 PM
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Re: Poll: IQ
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I have taken a few online IQ tests and have scored from 135 to 143 on them. [/ QUOTE ] me too, except 130-145. [ QUOTE ] I still make terrible decisions playing poker all the time. I would also like to know who these super geniuses are that are 170+. [/ QUOTE ] i dont think IQ directly correlates to poker aptitude... [/ QUOTE ] As a member of Mensa IMHO intelligence and poker skills have zero correllation. I think it is correct to say that first one needs an aptitude for poker. A couple of other skills unrelated to IQ are discipline and patience. Emotional control would be another skill unrelated to intelligence. My favorite example is a recent post by Iceman where he's in the BB and "feels" or "sees" an opportunity to knock UTG off TPTK. There was some criticism about executing the play OOP, but IMHO the example of recognizing the opportunity, then planning and executing, is a measure of knowledge, skill, and ability that are unrelated to IQ.
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#48
05-02-2005, 02:52 PM
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Re: Poll: IQ
I think a common theme you'll notice on many IQ test questions is the need to pick up on patterns quickly, then exploit the patterns for one's own purposes. I think the ability to do this is directly applicable to NL poker.
There are, of course, traits that poker player must have that are unrelated to IQ, such as discipline, patience, etc. as mentioned above. However, with those being givens, I'd have to believe IQ is strongly correlated to poker-playing ability.
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#49
05-02-2005, 03:16 PM
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Re: Poll: IQ
[ QUOTE ]
"is everybody at this forum that high above the mean?" Not even close. "welscher" Weschler. "i am not even sure if all scales even go up to 170..." The Stanford-Binet V and the Cattell Culture-Fair Forms A+B can identify adult persons with an IQ at or above 170 using a SD of 16. Internet tests are garbage (with a few exceptions). And there is a positive correlation between IQ and anything requiring thought. That's the idea. Given that poker requires one to simulate the thoughts and behaviors of the opposition on an ongoing basis ('higher-order intentionality'), which is one of the most complicated tasks the brain can perform, I'd say poker skill is very highly correlated with IQ. Of course, most players never get to the stage where 'higher-order intentionality' makes or breaks them as a player in a given game; but, assuming they get there, what distinguishes the great player from the merely good or average player is probably 'nothing more' than raw neurological potential. [/ QUOTE ] Close, but the correct spelling is Wechsler. When I became a member of Mensa in 1980 I scored in the top 1%. I'm not just a genius, but a certified super genius. So why did I push with the nut flush and not even see the possibility of the str8 flush that beat me? Why do I do all the stupid things at the poker table that I do? Why can't I come off tilt when I know how destructive that is to my game? I can give testimony to the fact that nothing in the world is more common than unrewarded genius. Some poker skills that are rewarded, and that have nothing to do with IQ, are desire, perseverance, determination, patience,and aggression. My suggestion is that emotions and psychology have nothing to do with IQ, yet are a great part of the game of poker. It is a game of skill, like hitting a 100mph fastball. Having a high IQ may give you an advantage in learning the game, but it won't help you play the game. We all know players that can talk a good game,(I'm one of those) but can you bring it to the table? (Not me,yet!)
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#50
05-02-2005, 03:52 PM
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Re: Poll: IQ
[ QUOTE ]
As a member of Mensa IMHO intelligence and poker skills have zero correllation. [/ QUOTE ] Stopped reading after that.
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