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  #1  
Old 12-22-2005, 10:27 AM
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Default Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

Villian is 20/0/1.9, I have about 50 hands with opponent, he hadn't done anything noteworthy.

I'm figuring at the point of me calling the check/raise on the flop at worse I have effective odds of 7 to 2.5 on calling down. But I figure most of the time I'm behind here and I've got the risk of the flush draw hitting.

It seems unlikely the check/raiser was a worse hand, although it's possible he's value raising a flush draw.

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is BB with 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, CO calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB calls, Hero calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG folds, MP1 calls, CO calls, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises</font>, Hero calls, MP1 folds, CO calls.

Turn: (8.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls, CO calls.

River: (11.50 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls, CO folds.

Final Pot: 13.50 BB
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  #2  
Old 12-22-2005, 10:45 AM
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Default Re: Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

A flop check-raise can mean numerous things in this instance; you have no reason to assign villain an A based on the action thus far. Villain's check-raise may be for protection purposes (assuming he thought MP1 would auto-bet the flop) when he holds medium/high pocket pair or, as you've stated, to extract value out of flush draw, etc.

I think 3-betting the flop is your best option here, since a turn raise will scare off CO, who is likely drawing near dead (unless, of course, he's holding a flush draw). In my opinion, 3-betting the flop kinda under represents your hand and may entice calls. If villain caps then I think you should consider reverting to call down mode.

Based on the action, folding is out of the question in my opinion.
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  #3  
Old 12-22-2005, 10:59 AM
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Default Re: Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

The SB cold called 1.5 SB preflop. So his most likely holdings are a pocketpair, high cards or a suited ace.
With so many players involved, it is very unlikely, that the SB makes this play without an ace. The flop check raise was intended to find out, who had the ace. If the bet came from the initial raiser, than he had to suggest, that MP1's kicker is stronger than his own one. But as the bet came from you, he could hope, that your kicker was not very strong, so he could continue betting out.

I would fold on the turn UI, but later I would always have doubts, whether I had made a correct play. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]
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  #4  
Old 12-22-2005, 12:11 PM
Clarkmeister Clarkmeister is offline
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Default Re: Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

[ QUOTE ]
Can I fold this

[/ QUOTE ]

no
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  #5  
Old 12-22-2005, 12:14 PM
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Default Re: Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

Clarkmeister, Are you saying I can't fold the flop or based on the way the hand played out, I can't fold on any street?
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  #6  
Old 12-22-2005, 12:17 PM
Clarkmeister Clarkmeister is offline
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Default Re: Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

[ QUOTE ]
Clarkmeister, Are you saying I can't fold the flop or based on the way the hand played out, I can't fold on any street?

[/ QUOTE ]

Folding on the flop is absolutely insane. Folding on the turn is near insane. Folding on the river is bad, but not quite insane.
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  #7  
Old 12-22-2005, 01:54 PM
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Default Re: Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

[ QUOTE ]
Clarkmeister, Are you saying I can't fold the flop or based on the way the hand played out, I can't fold on any street?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm assuming you lost this, but there's no fold anywhere here. Don't be results-oriented.
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  #8  
Old 12-22-2005, 02:10 PM
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Default Re: Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

I think that you have to call this down. I see a lot of players making a check/raise move here to try and steal or if they played preflop incorrectly and are holding a pair of Q or K here... they are a little peed off that the flop came like this. But you should call down here cause you are probably winning this pot at least 1 in 3 times.
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  #9  
Old 12-22-2005, 02:20 PM
Rootabager Rootabager is offline
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Default Re: Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

At party 2/4 you see alot of dumb things happen. I wont ever fold this.
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  #10  
Old 12-22-2005, 02:31 PM
The Goober The Goober is offline
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Default Re: Can I fold this, good hand?, good pot

What about raising the turn? If CO isn't an idiot, his play looks a lot like a flush draw and it'd be nice to charge him some more. I don't think it's that likely that SB will 3-bet us here with a better A (with his stats), and if we get SB to fold a worse hand, the bet we lose is made up for by CO's cold-call. The Q is a good card for us, since it means that we could now have a lot of chopping out against a better A - and it makes it even more important to get more of CO's money in there. Finally, we might give ourselves the option of a free showdown, although I doubt we'd want to take it here.
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