how to solve certain problems with the ICM (an algorithm)

[rachelwxm]

I was thinking about the same thing. Next time, I don't even need any intermidiate results to cover my errors. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[The Yugoslavian]

Thanks for the response!

I think I understand very little of what is actually going on in that thread [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img].

So, if the difference in the two numbers is .1 then that would be a +$1EV in a 10+1 game? But if there is a difference of .01 then it is only +$.1EV and almost surely insignificant?

[dethgrind]

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for the response!

I think I understand very little of what is actually going on in that thread [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img].

So, if the difference in the two numbers is .1 then that would be a +$1EV in a 10+1 game? But if there is a difference of .01 then it is only +$.1EV and almost surely insignificant?

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess I was a bit inconsistent and sometimes used % and sometimes left it as a decimal. A difference of .1 is the same as a difference of 10% of the prize pool, which is huge. $10 in a 10+1 game. A difference of .1% is the same as a difference of .001; this is far too close for the model to be helpful. $0.10 in a 10+1 game.

Remember that ICM calculator link gives you a fraction of the prize pool. The prize pool for a 10+1 game is $100. So if it says 1600 chips have a $EV of .1844, that means $100*.1844 = $18.44 in a 10+1 game.

I don't really know how big the difference needs to be for the decision to be clear. I'd say a difference of .002 or less is almost certainly too close, and a difference of .05 is almost certainly enough to be clear in most cases.

Hope that clears up some confusion [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[The Yugoslavian]

Yes, of course!

Your message is quite helpful -- I may have been getting confused by the % and decimal numbers but I've got it now.

I was a philosophy major, can ya tell? [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Then yes, 10% would be way too huge to pass up while .1% (or .001) would be marginal to say the least (especially if your read on the opponent is suspect). .05 (or 5%) must be fairly definitive because it's +$5 decision -- huge for a 10+1 game where even the best players probably won't be able to profit much more than $5/tourny.

I definitely think that shorthanded I need to be rasing allin for value more as there is steal equity, most of the time I won't be dominated (just a slight-somewhat underdog), and the blinds are a significant percentage of my stack. Still, sometimes it's hard going all-in with K4o for value when it seems like such a dog to hands that will call (and at the 20+2 lewel I'm at it is hard to tell who will start calling shorthanded with semi-crappy hands).

Thanks for the help, I will definitely be using the ICM/PokerCalculator combo more in my search for the most +EV (or least -EV) decisions.

Again, thanks for your help!

[RacersEdge]

Any links that explains what ICM is? This thread is the only one that comes up in a search.

[lastchance]

Independent chip model. Shows how much value your chips have in a tournament.

[RacersEdge]

[ QUOTE ]
Independent chip model. Shows how much value your chips have in a tournament.


[/ QUOTE ]

I figured it did something like that. I was looking for the details of what it says/predicts, assumptions it makes, etc.

[dethgrind]

Here pzhon explains it pretty well.

[BradleyT]

Let's bump this for another week.

[Vanquish]

Not only does this thread deserve to be bumped, but I have a question as well. What is the calculation used to determine the % stake in the prize pool (aka the ICM calculation)? I've searched and the best answer I could come up with is some Mathematica code that I, as NOT a programmer, do not understand. I was hoping to plug it into Excel and make a spreadsheet of various situations so I can start using this concept more in the live games I play. Thanks!