Small flush draw from BB in unraised pot

[ QUOTE ]
What are you advocating? Fold pre-flop? check/fold the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

Personally... yes... I check fold this hand on the flop and I especially don't fire a ton of money into the pot on the river when it appears he is on the same draw as me based on his turn smooth call.

I know folding your blind in this spot seems odd, and a little weak tight... but I think the amount of money you loose when you have the "under-draw" will not be recovered when you're against a real hand. Honestly, if you hit your flush... how many times are you going to get paid off big by TPTK...

The answer is not often. People are going to fold all those hands that you want calling you down. TPTK is probaby just going to say "nice-big-blind-special" and fold.

I'm just saying, in general, this is the exact type of reverse implied odds described by everyone that plays NL at a higher level.

If you have a hard-on for suited connectors, raise with them to force out those over-draws.

P.S... before I made the original "fold comment"... I hadn't even read through the whole hand and/or the results.

So I'm not being results orienteed. It's just my philosphy.

[TheWorstPlayer]

Since it went over so well last time, I'll tell you that I seriously fold this preflop. The vast majority of the time you're going to be playing a non-nut draw out of position with this hand. Yuck. It's going to be expensive to draw and if you ever get action, you're likely beat.

[ QUOTE ]
Since it won't over so well last time, I'll tell you that I seriously fold this preflop. The vast majority of the time you're going to be playing a non-nut draw out of position with this hand. Yuck. It's going to be expensive to draw and if you ever get action, you're likely beat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Amen... finally someone else on 2+2 that doesn't feel the need to play like gus hanson.

[fuego527]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Since it won't over so well last time, I'll tell you that I seriously fold this preflop. The vast majority of the time you're going to be playing a non-nut draw out of position with this hand. Yuck. It's going to be expensive to draw and if you ever get action, you're likely beat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Amen... finally someone else on 2+2 that doesn't feel the need to play like gus hanson.

[/ QUOTE ]

Like him in the sense that we are aggressive and allow ourselves to get in situations where we might, heaven forbid, actually have to play poker?

[HoldEmKillah]

[ QUOTE ]
"Plus... you have virtually no money invested... "
I hate this statement.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've never EVER EVER understood why it's so bad to go broke in an unraised pot. I have no clue.

[captZEEbo1]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
"Plus... you have virtually no money invested... "
I hate this statement.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've never EVER EVER understood why it's so bad to go broke in an unraised pot. I have no clue.

[/ QUOTE ]
I do...it means you're putting in TOO many bets/raises with a crappy hand without the pot starting out as big, you follow? Like with the preflop raise bloater, it's easier to get the whole stack in with 3 pot sized bets or something. But in general I agree with you. Basic sentiment of going broke in an unraised pot is, don't defend TPTK for your stack in an unraised pot (without a read of course). I've stacked people that limped AA HU with me in the BB when the flop came like K72r (getting it allin on the flop)...that's pretty bad IMO.

[TheWorstPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Since it won't over so well last time, I'll tell you that I seriously fold this preflop. The vast majority of the time you're going to be playing a non-nut draw out of position with this hand. Yuck. It's going to be expensive to draw and if you ever get action, you're likely beat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Amen... finally someone else on 2+2 that doesn't feel the need to play like gus hanson.

[/ QUOTE ]

Like him in the sense that we are aggressive and allow ourselves to get in situations where we might, heaven forbid, actually have to play poker?

[/ QUOTE ]
Oh ok. What's your line postflop? I want to learn how to play poker.

[fuego527]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Since it won't over so well last time, I'll tell you that I seriously fold this preflop. The vast majority of the time you're going to be playing a non-nut draw out of position with this hand. Yuck. It's going to be expensive to draw and if you ever get action, you're likely beat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Amen... finally someone else on 2+2 that doesn't feel the need to play like gus hanson.

[/ QUOTE ]

Like him in the sense that we are aggressive and allow ourselves to get in situations where we might, heaven forbid, actually have to play poker?

[/ QUOTE ]
Oh ok. What's your line postflop? I want to learn how to play poker.

[/ QUOTE ]

If I was running over the table, I'd probably lead. OW, I'd check and call/raise dependant on the bettor, number of people behind, etc. I mean, you are getting 7-1 preflop with a suited 1-gap, you are really folding? I've always assumed (and still do) that you are better than me, but I don't understand how you don't think completing here is EV+.

[JFB37]

So what if you flop it?

This is a semi hijack, but I think it fits in. Here is a hand I played almost a year ago and it has bugged me ever since. The 3/3 PL game at the Vic. Three limpers preflop, sb checks, I check in the bb with 7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Flop: T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

SB checks, I bet the pot (15), folded to uber aggressive Skandi on the button who re-pots (45), I re-re-pot (180), Skandi re-re-re-pots (720) and I fold. (I had about 1000 behind at that point.)

Obviously, my line sucked. Check call the flop? Check call all the way if no diamond comes?