Have I become a losing player? (long)

[SomethingClever]

First off, I don't think I'm any kind of poker genius. I think I'm competent, and the main reason I win money is because my opponents suck. However, I do continue to study and read these boards, particularly the HUSH forum (I play 6-max).

I need advice. I am on a horrible run, and I feel like I've tried everything.

Background: (I'll keep it as short as possible).

-Started playing in 2003. 25NL on Party. Turned $50 into about $300, lost it all. I was horrible.

-Read Theory of Poker, redeposited $50. Lost it.

-Tried one more time with $50. Built up a $500 bankroll, lost $200, cashed out.

-Played $0.01/$0.02 NL for a while. Decided to learn limit. Played .05/.10 on Stars. Moved up to .25/.50, broke even.

-Finally decided to put $300 into Party and play .5/1. Kept studying.

-Won 4.75 BB/100 over 35,000 hands.

-Mixed in some 1/2. 20-30k-ish. Did well.

-Took a shot at 2/4. Played too tight (13/8 tight). Won 0.3 BB/100 for 20,000 hands.

-Tried 1/2 6-max. Had a 300 BB downswing, but still won 2.3 BB/100 over 40,000 hands.

-Tried 2/4 6-max. 20,000 at 1.9 BB/100.

-Moved to 5/10 6-max. I'm sitting at about 36k at 0.3 BB/100.

-Tired of the swings, I try the new 3/6 6-max. Win 80 BB, lose 100 BB. About 2,500-3,000 hands so far.

So..... I'm at about 40,000 hands of essentially breakeven poker. I've played 175,000 hands in my career. Now a full 1/4 of that has been at a breakeven level.

I have tried.... playing looser. Playing tighter. Playing 1 table. Playing 4 tables. Playing 2 tables. Playing different limits. Taking breaks. Playing long sessions. Playing short sessions. Not checking my results. Checking my results obsessively.

Nothing seems to work at this point.

WTFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF?

[rory]

I think you win.

Take a break and come back when you aren't feeling distraught.

[MaxPower]

I don't know, but I have played breakeven poker for 50,000 hands at 15/30.

Drop down to 2/4 6-max where you know you can win and play until your build up your bankroll and your confidence comes back.

Also, swings are going to happen no matter how good you get. If you can't deal with that, it might be best to treat poker as an enjoyable hobby and play at a level where you can deal with them.

[SomethingClever]

[ QUOTE ]
Drop down to 2/4 6-max

[/ QUOTE ]

Problem with this is that there's no rakeback on Stars.

Sweet rakeback. You're my only friend.

My bankroll is good... I can play 3/6 6-max without sweating the downswings too much, but I have been treading water for so long, I want to make sure I'm still a winner.

[bds]

Would it be helpful to have someone else playing your limit and who is a proven winner review hands for you? That was a huge help to me when I moved up to 10/20 and was struggling. Helped me identify leaks and improved my game and win rate tremendously.

[flair1239]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Drop down to 2/4 6-max

[/ QUOTE ]

Problem with this is that there's no rakeback on Stars.

Sweet rakeback. You're my only friend.

My bankroll is good... I can play 3/6 6-max without sweating the downswings too much, but I have been treading water for so long, I want to make sure I'm still a winner.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am in a simaliar situation at 5/10 full. Over 55,000 hands I have had (2) 200BB downswings (just completed one last night), and (3) 100BB downswings.

At previous levels I never experienced anything more than a couple 100BB downswings.

The problem is when I am not downswinging, I run very well. So I will have a 3-4 day period (I play 15-17K hands a month) where I have a swing. Then run at 2.5-3BB/100 over the next 10-16K hands. Very frustrating.

I cashout half of my monthly winnings, and the average cashout has actually been pretty healthy. But my WR looks pretty crappy.

To address your issue. You probably do have some leaks. But the fact that your breaking even should tell you that you are not a losing player.

Just continue to study.

[SomethingClever]

[ QUOTE ]
Would it be helpful to have someone else playing your limit and who is a proven winner review hands for you? That was a huge help to me when I moved up to 10/20 and was struggling. Helped me identify leaks and improved my game and win rate tremendously.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have tried this. I think it helped identify a leak. However, I haven't broken out of the slump yet.

Another interesting thing I just looked up: My winrate for the last 100k (all 6-max) is 1.5 BB/100. That's totally respectable and I'm happy with it. What sucks is that the last 40k is at 0.3, and that's the stretch that's been played at higher limits.

[Grisgra]

[ QUOTE ]
Another interesting thing I just looked up: My winrate for the last 100k (all 6-max) is 1.5 BB/100. That's totally respectable and I'm happy with it. What sucks is that the last 40k is at 0.3, and that's the stretch that's been played at higher limits.

[/ QUOTE ]

You really shouldn't be. That's marginal at best (unless you're super-multi-tabling), and if your true win-rate is only 1.5BB/100, an unavoidable byproduct is long stretches at only 0.5BB/100 or so.

If a 40k stretch at 0.3BB/100 bothers you, then you need to become better than a 1.5BB/100 player. (Of course, it may be that you're a 2 or 2.5BB/100 player at the lower limits, and you have simply failed to adjust to the higher limits, or are on a nasty run of bad luck there.)

[SomethingClever]

[ QUOTE ]
unless you're super-multi-tabling

[/ QUOTE ]

The 100k was all 4-tabling 6-max.

I tried 2 tabling the 5/10 for a while as you advised. It seemed to help.

[Grisgra]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
unless you're super-multi-tabling

[/ QUOTE ]

The 100k was all 4-tabling 6-max.

I tried 2 tabling the 5/10 for a while as you advised. It seemed to help.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, obviously making a total of ~5BB/hr is good, but like I've said elsewhere, there are hidden negatives in multitabling for a low BB/100, and the high potential for a long and potentially damaging-to-the-psyche dry spell is one of the biggies.