10-20 AK hand - What do my opponents have?

JTG51 · #1 12-29-2002, 03:22 PM

I'm UTG+1 with A [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] K [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img] .

UTG limps, I raise and my left hand opponent (LHO) 3 bets. Everyone else folds, UTG calls.

UTG just sat down 5 minutes ago, I don't know anything about him. LHO has been in the game for maybe an hour. He's a pretty loose limper, but I haven't seen him do anything unusual yet.

Does anyone like a cap here? I've been making this play more lately when I raise with AK and AQ and get 3 bet. I think you often times gain a lot more than one SBs value for the cost. I decided to just call this time.

3 of us see the flop for 3 bets each.

Flop: Q [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] J [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] 3 [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img]

I've got a gutshot, a back door nut flush draw and two overcards which may or may not be good.

UTG bets, I call, LHO raises and UTG calls. I call again.

Turn: [Q [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] J [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] 3 [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img] ] A [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img]

UTG bets again. I see LHO grabbing enough chips to raise again, so I fold.

I wasn't really happy with my decisions on any street. What do you put my opponents on, and how would you have played it on each street?

Thanks.

pufferfish · #2 12-29-2002, 04:15 PM

Hope you don't mind a micro-limit rookie taking a shot at this. [img]/forums/images/icons/blush.gif[/img]

I'll put LHO on a big pair AA-JJ, which explains the pre-flop 3-bet. More likely that he has QQ or JJ, giving him at set to protect. Less likely AA or KK because you have one of each. Also, would it be typical at this table/limit/situation for someone to bet an overpair so strongly? (Edited in: except for the set of Aces on the turn.)

Hard to say about UTG since he's an unknown. Maybe AQo, QJx, KTx, or maybe he's just a nut playing garbage. [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

I think I would have played it the same way you did.

mikelow · #3 12-29-2002, 04:38 PM

I would have folded the flop. I don't like the cold call because
you are really needing the gutshot or the backdoor flush. Even an ace or king aren't clean outs.

On the turn, it looks like two pair (or even a set) so the fold is clear-cut.

Tyler Durden · #4 12-29-2002, 04:58 PM

You say maybe he's playing QJx, KTx or maybe just garbage. If those two hands are unsuited, those are garbage hands in my book. Players waste a lot of chips by playing hands like QTo, QJo, KJo, and KTo in early position.

Tyler Durden · #5 12-29-2002, 05:03 PM

Deciding what to do preflop with AK when it's been 3-bet is something I've been struggling with. It has a lot to do with what your opponents raising standards are, of course. Against a player whose raises I respect, I'd just call the 3-bet. You may be up against AA-JJ. AK is likely but I think AQ is less likely b/c most solid players would muck AQ to a raise.

On the turn, there aren't too many hands you can beat if you call or raise here. You lose to QQ, JJ, AQ, and chop with AK. I suppose it's possible he'd 3-bet with TT but that's not going to happen often enough for calling/raising to be the correct play. You have 4 clean outs (the tens). But even if you spike one of them, you may end up chopping.

I like your turn fold.

pufferfish · #6 12-29-2002, 05:10 PM

After I posted I was thinking if the other two EP's were reasonable (unknown with UTG) then your outs are pretty chewed up. I'm more inclined to agree with mikelow that a fold on the flop is best.

On the other hand, for the same price, you could have raised UTG's flop bet. If LHO 3-bets and UTG still calls you would probably feel better about folding. If UTG folds, then at least it's HU, but I think still a tough call.

pufferfish · #7 12-29-2002, 05:19 PM

You say maybe he's playing QJx, KTx or maybe just garbage. If those two hands are unsuited, those are garbage hands in my book.

Agreed, I didn't state that clearly. Also, there's worse garbage that I've seen people play. UTG could have Q3, J3, or Q/ J with some other lousy kicker. Now that's real garbage. [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

Edited in: One last thought, UTG is playing any two suited and takes the hand when another heart falls on the river. [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

JTG51 · #8 12-29-2002, 06:47 PM

Mike, I think we either have a little confusion about terminology, or if my original post wasn't clear. You said you don't like the cold call on the flop. I only called one bet at a time, when I hear cold call I think of calling more than one bet at a time.

Are you saying you would have folded on the flop when UTG bet, without seeing what LHO was going to do? It's certainly an option, I'm just trying to clarify.

mikelow · #9 12-29-2002, 07:10 PM

I would call on the flop, but would fold the turn unless a heart or ten came. An ace or king isn't a clean out.

andyfox · #10 12-30-2002, 12:14 AM

UTG has K-T, LHO has the other 2 Aces.

I'd have folded on the flop because I'm caught between a rock and a hard place. LHO 3-bet a UTG limper and a UTG+1 raiser pre-flop. Now UTG bets into a flop with Q-J in it and I don't have a Q or a J. It's going to be raised at least once on the flop. If I catch an A on the turn, I'm behind to A-Q or A-J and I can't make a flush.

"I see LHO grabbing enough chips to raise again"

Good job. Always watch the guy on your left before you act.