Party $400 PLO8 hand

Wintermute · #1 10-20-2005, 09:53 PM

$400 PL Omaha Hi/Lo
Seat 9 is the button
Total number of players : 9
Seat 7: Hero ( $592.70 )
Seat 9: X ( $389.40 )
Seat 4: X ( $400.20 )
Seat 5: X ( $400 )
Seat 1: X ( $265.80 )
Seat 10: X ( $180.95 )
Seat 3: X ( $396 )
Seat 8: Villain ( $280 )
Seat 2: X ( $80 )
X posts small blind [$2].
X posts big blind [$4].
Villain posts big blind [$4].

** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ 9d Qs Qc Td ]

X folds.
X folds.
Hero calls [$4].
Villain raises [$11].
X folds.
X calls [$13].
X folds.
Hero calls [$11].

** Dealing Flop ** [ Kc, Jd, 7c ]

X checks.
Hero bets [$46.55].
Villain calls [$46.55].
X calls [$46.55].

** Dealing Turn ** [ 7d ]

X checks.
Hero bets [$90].
Villain calls [$90].
X folds.

** Dealing River ** [ 9s ]

Hero bets [$200].

emptyshell · #2 10-21-2005, 12:23 AM

I probably would have checked the turn. I'd be more likely to try this bluff heads up but with two people in, it's too likely someone likes the board pairing.

The river bet is OK since it puts the villain allin, and he might call with a 7. If he's aggressive, though, I think check/call would be better.

BlueBear · #3 10-21-2005, 02:02 AM

Weak-tight maybe, but I check/fold the turn here, especially in this multi-way situation. You'll get into a very tough spot if a player in later position calls you, regardless of what the river card may be. I don't really see the point of making a blocking bet at the river though because you're not going to get a better hand to fold and a worse hand will probably fold. Looks like more of a choice of check-calling/check-folding the river.

Wintermute · #4 10-21-2005, 11:52 AM

The river bet isn't a blocking bet--it's a value bet. I think the Villain definitely has a hand I beat but that he won't bluff into a board that he didn't raise on the turn.

The turn bet is suspect, I agree, but I think it's the amount that's wrong. I should have bet less, maybe half the pot instead of 80% or whatever it is. That would be a good spot for the blocking bet. I think if I check there I get taken off my hand.

jthegreat · #5 10-21-2005, 01:11 PM

You aren't worried about AA?

Wintermute · #6 10-21-2005, 04:13 PM

Worried? I'm hoping he calls w/ AA, and that's a likely hand for him to have played this way. (I have a straight, it seems like some people missed that)

emptyshell · #7 10-21-2005, 05:06 PM

Assuming he has AA, are you thinking that your turn bet priced you in to draw out, or was it purely a semibluff? I thought this was the issue the previous poster was raising, and it affects the size of the turn bet that makes the most sense. Personally, I think you are drawing to a Q far too often here, but it depends a lot on your opponents playing style.

Wintermute · #8 10-21-2005, 05:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Assuming he has AA, are you thinking that your turn bet priced you in to draw out, or was it purely a semibluff? I thought this was the issue the previous poster was raising, and it affects the size of the turn bet that makes the most sense.

[/ QUOTE ]
My bet on the turn is meant to intimidate and set up a river all-in almost regardless of what card comes off. I want it to look like I'm milking him. Of course, if he pushes, I'm in trouble, and I think I'd have to seriously consider folding--but I don't sense any strength based on the prev action in the hand, and that board is scary for anything that doesn't raise the flop, IMO.

[ QUOTE ]
Personally, I think you are drawing to a Q far too often here, but it depends a lot on your opponents playing style.

[/ QUOTE ]
Huh? What do you put him on? A seven? No fking way.

emptyshell · #9 10-21-2005, 05:28 PM

Well, at the time of the turn bet, there are still two people in the pot. Whether the bet makes sense is a combination of a lot of factors, including the chance you are drawing dead, getting AA to fold, the flush hitting on the river, and you hitting the straight and getting paid off.

After the turn flat call by only the preflop raiser, the river bet seems like the right move (although betting less might be OK, too). The turn bet is much less clear to me since there is a pretty large range of hands they could be playing. Taking a peak at their Fold to Flop Bet % might help.

If it was me, I might make the same move, except the river would brick, I'd bet allin and get called by AA. In general, it seems like you are overplaying a mediocre drawing hand, but maybe it's a money-making opportunity in PLO8 that I haven't mastered yet.

Wintermute · #10 10-21-2005, 05:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Well, at the time of the turn bet, there are still two people in the pot. Whether the bet makes sense is a combination of a lot of factors, including the chance you are drawing dead, getting AA to fold, the flush hitting on the river, and you hitting the straight and getting paid off.

[/ QUOTE ]
FWIW, it might matter that the guy who folded on the turn was relatively short (he's the one w/ $180 at the start of the hand). So I figured any strength from him and we'd have heard about it on the flop.

[ QUOTE ]

After the turn flat call by only the preflop raiser, the river bet seems like the right move (although betting less might be OK, too). The turn bet is much less clear to me since there is a pretty large range of hands they could be playing. Taking a peak at their Fold to Flop Bet % might help.

If it was me, I might make the same move, except the river would brick, I'd bet allin and get called by AA. In general, it seems like you are overplaying a mediocre drawing hand, but maybe it's a money-making opportunity in PLO8 that I haven't mastered yet.

[/ QUOTE ]
I sort of agree (about me overplaying marginal hands)--that's why I'm posting these marginal hands. I've definitely been running well. Trying to defend these weird plays will hopefully keep me from going off the deep end with "creative" semi-bluffs. I'm going to put another couple hands in this thread, take a look at them for me.