3-bet pre-flop or check-raise the flop?

[kiddo]

If we dont autobet flop it will be harder for guy to make up for what he loses when he only calls with good hands preflop. If we autobetflop he can just move his preflopdecision to flop.

Harrington in his 2nd book says we should raise more out of position then in position preflop because we want the hand to end as soon as possible, that is, we want as much of the pot as possible to come in preflop because postflop he can use his position.

I cant see how this doesnt apply at all here.

Not only does the guy never 3betting preflop give up bets, he also checks flop every time and let guy in position decide how to play hand. So wouldnt it be good if guy in position stopped autobetting flop and checked some of the flops he hated and some he liked? If other guy then starts to autobet turn he can take it from there, and now he got 4 cards on board to use against other guy.

The alternative to not 3bet preflop cant be to 3bet every time we got a strong hand. I guess Negreanu was mixing it up, calling with some of his strong hands.

Yes, I agree that a good solution here is to autobet less. There were numerous occassions during this match where Negreanu raised pre flop, autobet a (say) A J x board, and then folded to the check raise that came on pretty much every single one of these broadway-type flops. I guess the reason he continued to autobet (not always, but a good proportion of the time, even though the flop bet was rarely taking it down) were for metagame reasons, although I can see there is a good argument here for checking in position and betting (with the high likelyhood of being checkraised) for value.

What you're saying makes a lot of sense to me. I think the challenging part of this defense against the flop check-raise is finding the right balance of checks with flops you like vs. flops you don't like. You have to keep your opponent off-balance enough that he doesn't interpret your check as a liscense to bet the turn and pick up the pot. But at the same time, you don't want to check too many good flops or you will not be getting enough value out of your good hands/flops. I think this delicate balance that needs to be maintained is a good indicator of the strength of the flop check-raise. That doesn't mean it can't be combatted but it takes an opponent with very good post-flop skills (like Negreanu) to do it.

[kiddo]

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I think this delicate balance that needs to be maintained is a good indicator of the strength of the flop check-raise. That doesn't mean it can't be combatted but it takes an opponent with very good post-flop skills (like Negreanu) to do it.

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Yep, if u are good postflop there got to be ways to counterattack against a guy that always calls preflop and always check flop. Like this guy.

But what happend during the session? U get a feeling DN is angry at the guy. Why?