New to PLO, PP 25PL

CanKid · #1 02-04-2005, 02:48 PM

I'm new to this game, looking for some good fundamental basics as far as advice goes, here's two hands I played during my lunch break today. Unfortunately I have no reads as I didn't play long.

Hand 1
Party Poker Pot-Limit Omaha High, $0.5 BB (9 handed) converter

MP2 ($25.8)
MP3 ($23)
CO ($23)
Button ($43)
SB ($14.1)
BB ($17.3)
UTG ($30.9)
UTG+1 ($55.85)
Hero ($30.65)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.50, Hero calls $0.50, MP2 calls $0.50, MP3 raises to $3.25, 1 fold, Button calls $3.25, 2 folds, UTG+1 calls $2.75, Hero calls $2.75, MP2 calls $2.75.

Flop: ($17) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero checks, MP2 checks, MP3 checks, Button checks.

Turn: ($17) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $5, MP2 calls $5, MP3 folds, Button calls $5, UTG+1 folds.

River: ($32) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets $10, MP2 raises to $17.55 (All-In), Button folds, Hero calls $7.55.

Final Pot: $67.10

Hand 2
Party Poker Pot-Limit Omaha High, $0.5 BB (10 handed) converter

MP3 ($51.6)
CO ($25.8)
Button ($23.5)
SB ($23.5)
BB ($44)
UTG ($15.1)
UTG+1 ($17.3)
UTG+2 ($32.4)
MP1 ($56.85)
Hero ($25)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. Hero posts a blind of $0.5.
2 folds, UTG+2 calls $0.50, MP1 calls $0.50, Hero (poster) checks, MP3 calls $0.50, 1 fold, Button calls $0.50, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($3.50) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+2 checks, MP1 checks, Hero checks, MP3 checks, Button checks.

Turn: ($3.50) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+2 checks, MP1 checks, Hero bets $2, MP3 folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds.

Final Pot: $5.50

Thanks in advance,
Jay

Token · #2 02-04-2005, 03:07 PM

There is some good PLO advice at www.winningonlinepoker.com. The Ciaffone books are highly recommended.

I would fold both these hands pre-flop. In Hand 1, you are behind to some holding a pair of queens or holding a queen and a five. Getting two callers behind you on the turn is not good news, but then again your bet was small. You might have to check and fold on the river. In Hand 2, I think I would check the turn as well with all the two flush draws and straight on the board.

rickofcampbell · #3 02-04-2005, 03:12 PM

Hand 1: I would have bet at least 1/2 the pot on the turn.

On the river you are getting great odds on your call, so there is no decision. You most likely have the best hand or a split.

Bye the way, you should fold hands like these before the flop.

Hand 2: I prefer to bet these on the flop if most of the players have already checked, but betting the turn is fine after seeing everyone check the flop.

If you get called the only draw I would want to make is the straight flush.

BluffTHIS! · #4 02-04-2005, 03:16 PM

Regarding basics, you should first of all order and read Bob Ciaffone's book, Omaha Holdem Poker, and then later, his and Reuben's Pot Limit and No Limit Poker.

Regarding hand #1, this is a horrible starting hand composed of 2 holdem hands that won't cut it in omaha. You are looking to make nut straights/flushes/fulls/Top 2 (big) pair, and need FOUR CARDS THAT WORK TOGETHER. Having played it, you were right to bet the turn but should have checked and folded if there was a bet unless you put the player as someone who would draw at a flush with a board pair in which case you might call but usually you would just be wasting your money. You certainly should have folded to the raise as you were beat by JJ/TT being played slow or even by J5 or T5, with J5 being my guess as to what you were shown. You could only beat a stone bluff reraise (not likely in an unraised pot) or 44, and might split though unlikely.

Regarding hand #2, your semi-bluff bet was fine and did indeed win the pot, providing you would have checked the river regardless of what came.

Get that Ciaffone book, you'll be glad you did, and it will be hard for you to understand strategy discussions here without having done so. If you do have the book you have ignored it's advice entirely.

CanKid · #5 02-04-2005, 03:22 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would fold both these hands pre-flop

[/ QUOTE ]

I posted BB in hand 2.

CanKid · #6 02-04-2005, 04:02 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You certainly should have folded to the raise as you were beat by JJ/TT being played slow or even by J5 or T5, with J5 being my guess as to what you were shown. You could only beat a stone bluff reraise (not likely in an unraised pot) or 44, and might split though unlikely.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh?

[ QUOTE ]

your semi-bluff bet was fine and did indeed win the pot, providing you would have checked the river regardless of what came.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes check any river except SF of course.

[ QUOTE ]
If you do have the book you have ignored it's advice entirely.

[/ QUOTE ]

If I had read a solid Omaha book I wouldn't be posting hands this ugly. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

CanKid · #7 02-04-2005, 04:08 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: I would have bet at least 1/2 the pot on the turn.

On the river you are getting great odds on your call, so there is no decision. You most likely have the best hand or a split.

Bye the way, you should fold hands like these before the flop.

Hand 2: I prefer to bet these on the flop if most of the players have already checked, but betting the turn is fine after seeing everyone check the flop.

If you get called the only draw I would want to make is the straight flush.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good points, thanks.

CanKid · #8 02-04-2005, 04:09 PM

Hand 1: Raiser had QQ for the win, Hand 2: all folded as hand showed

Thanks for the feedback and the book advice, look forward to posting more in this forum.

Graham · #9 02-04-2005, 06:29 PM

Hand 1: Small boats on the river are just bluff catchers; a check-call would have been better. You get to snapp off bluffs that way. When you bet, very few worse hands will call, but better ones will punish your bet, as happened. If he's semi-reasonable you're opp has you toasted when he raises.