SS2 Phil Hellmuth Story

[Beavis68]

In the tournament section of SS2, Doyle tells a story of Phil Hellmuth raising with K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

the flop comes Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (may not have been a five but it was irrelavent).

Phil bets, gets raised all in and folds! And Doyle says he admired the play (Phil's fold) - WTF? He says because it was early in the tournament, this fold was correct... I don't get it. 14 or 15 NUT outs?

[Ghazban]

Its just because its early in a tournament and the edge of the OESFD there over a made hand is somewhat small. Its a good fold if you expect to have larger edges to take advantage of later.

[MLG]

it is never a good fold.

[Ghazban]

Never? You're a small dog (something like 57/43) to a set and, if the blinds are still small relative to stack sizes, you might not even have pot odds to call. I'd never fold it myself, but I don't quite believe folding is unequivocally wrong for everybody in every situation everywhere for all time.

[naegid]

what if your opponent shows you A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and you think you have a pretty big edge over the rest of the table (which i suspect PH probably does)?

Not that i would fold...

[Beavis68]

[ QUOTE ]
Never? You're a small dog (something like 57/43) to a set and, if the blinds are still small relative to stack sizes, you might not even have pot odds to call. I'd never fold it myself, but I don't quite believe folding is unequivocally wrong for everybody in every situation everywhere for all time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I wish the blinds and bet amounts had been discussed. And A9 is possible, but then you pick up all your pair outs. And you can't looke for every monster under the bed. If he had less than 10% of his stack involved, it was probably not a bad fold - but the fact that Doyle leaves these details out really annoys me.

[naegid]

yeah, Ghazbans post was exactly what i wanted to type but i lack the ability to but thoughts into words so succinctly...

I agree regarding monsters, stack/bet sizes are essential and we all know how much PH loves a huge laydown.

[Paul Phillips]

[ QUOTE ]
In the tournament section of SS2, Doyle tells a story of Phil Hellmuth raising with K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

the flop comes Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (may not have been a five but it was irrelavent).

Phil bets, gets raised all in and folds!

[/ QUOTE ]

I remember when this happened. It was a few years ago in the tunica $10K event, and I was at the next table over. If I remember it correctly there were three players in on the flop and phil called a raise from one of them; then when the action came around again the first guy went all-in and both folded. The guy who moved all-in had top two.

[Aceshigh7]

A tournament is not like a ring game. Why risk everything with a draw, even if you have a small advantage? It's just not smart.

[rickofcampbell]

He did not want to bust out of the tourn early with a coin flip.