JJ preflop : The Final Discussion (for the FAQ)

[t_perkin]

Ok in an attempt to beef up the FAQ a little bit I want a nice long discussion on playing JJ preflop.

Anyone with any good old posts feel free to let me know about them too.

This is your chance to be famous - you will be a published poker authority and your name will be permenantly inscribed in the 2+2 forum!

Get your finest literary caps on ladies and gents.

JJ Preflop (in a NLHE SnG):

When do you play for pair value and when for set value?

When would you push all in?

When would you call an all in?

Would you reraise to a min raise?

Does it play differently at higher buyins than low buyins?

and of course anything else you would like to add.
______________________

Lets have it.

Tim

[ZeeJustin]

Raise, but don't reraise with JJ. Call raises, fold if it has already been reraised before you have acted.

Without going into great detail, I think this is the best advice possible. Obviously there will be many exceptions.

[PrayingMantis]

Hey Tim,

I'd like to "contribute" two threads, that deal with different aspects of playing JJ.

1. Early on in a game:

JJ blues

2. Very intriguing discussion regarding JJ on the bubble. One of the greatest threads, IMO, and not because I was the one asking the question:

Tough JJ hand

[Jason Strasser]

The Tough JJ hand is a good thread, but has a lot of crap you'll have to wade through. (I think its a push)

[fnurt]

I sure hope Lori was taking the piss in that tough JJ thread.

Either way, it strikes me as far too specific a situation to be useful for an FAQ.

[stupidsucker]

I recently posted a JJ hand involving a good lay down.

Good Lay down or too weak?

I think its a great example of playing JJ aggressivly enough, but not enough to get you in trouble.

[PrayingMantis]

[ QUOTE ]
I sure hope Lori was taking the piss in that tough JJ thread.


[/ QUOTE ]

I don't exactly know what you mean by "taking the piss" (as English isn't actually my first language, etc, etc), but if you mean she was joking, so she wasn't. Lori is an excellent SNG player, despite the fact she rarely posts anything related to this on 2+2, and the fact that some people don't like her. She also has an amazing poker-mind, IMO. I've also exchanged some PMs with her regarding the JJ hand, and she made some very deep and impressive analysis of the hand, and of $EV of several different scenarios and types of opponents. It's not that she claims mini-raising is the only move, but she felt people here are neglecting some very valid options, and are WAY too sure of their thinking.

I don't want to defend her attitude toward this board, because she clearly has some sirious issues with how people write and express their thoughts. But as time passes, I tend to agree with her general opinion, about posters who seem to be much too decisive about their advice, while it's often pretty far from 100% correct. Also, I see more and more simply bad advice, and what's more: people who are just unwilling to accept the fact they are wrong, even if they are complete newbies. This could be very frustrating for more expirienced posters (not only Lori), who get tired, at some point, of all this stubborness.

[ QUOTE ]
Either way, it strikes me as far too specific a situation to be useful for an FAQ.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is possible, although I believe it's a great example of how complicate it is to play JJ in certain circumstances, perhaps more than most other hands. That's why I think it is appropriate for a "JJ FAQ". And also, good discussions about specific hands are a good way to introduce people to some of the fundamentals of SNG play at large.

[stupidsucker]

[ QUOTE ]
It's not that she claims mini-raising is the only move, but she felt people here are neglecting some very valid options, and are WAY too sure of their thinking.


[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
tend to agree with her general opinion, about posters who seem to be much too decisive about their advice, while it's often pretty far from 100% correct

[/ QUOTE ]

I can relate to these things emphatically. I try to objectivly look at situations and try to encourage discussions passed the usual thought process. Some people get very stern on their way is ALWAYS 100% correct and there will be no backing down. This limits disscussion, and stunts the learning process.

This thread is becoming something its not supposed to be... so im going to stop right here.

[fnurt]

I thought the advice was intriguing and well worth consideration. I was expressing hope that the delivery was tongue-in-cheek.

[t_perkin]

Yes I think you are probably right, too specific.

I will move it to my "interesting specific hands section" which will be in the next version of the FAQ hopefully.
Kind of like the hand quiz sections of the S+M books only without the nice clean cut answers [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Tim