Is Playing Poker Professionally Ethical?

[buffett]

[ QUOTE ]
-Have a net worth well over 100k
-Own a 200k house
-Have no debt


[/ QUOTE ]
Please explain the math behind these 3 statements. Shouldn't your net worth be north of 200k?
-web

[Warren Whitmore]

No thats why I play poker.

For a more detailed answer read "An open letter to Borris Spaskey." by Ayn Rand

[lacky]

well, so does golf, but I wouldn't feel bad intering a golf tourney, and I don't feel any different intering a poker tourney. I worked hard to be better at that activity than they are.

what does poker provide? well, it provides my family a parent always in the house to care for them. a father that can make all their games/activities and still afford lifes needs. if you are going to condeme poker you would need to condeme huge segments of the economy dealing with recreational activity, all of which serves little or no useful purpose.

bottom line for me is I use skills and talents I worked hard for to make the world a better place for my family.

I can live with that.

Steve

[ QUOTE ]
bottom line for me is I use skills and talents I worked hard for to make the world a better place for my family.

I can live with that.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can imagine a mobster saying that too.

[ QUOTE ]
if you are going to condeme poker you would need to condeme huge segments of the economy dealing with recreational activity, all of which serves little or no useful purpose.

[/ QUOTE ]

This I can agree with, although I question the characterization of entertainment as not useful.

[adios]

[ QUOTE ]
Is my making a living this way ethical? Am I hurting people by taking money that they need? How much of this money is contributed by problem gamblers that can't afford to lose it, yet dig themselves deep into debt trying to win back their money? How many people are deceived into poker addiction by the TV shows saying "anybody can make a final table"?

[/ QUOTE ]

My opinion only. One of the problems that I've observed about our society over the years is the lack of accountability that people have for their behavior and how willing so many people are to excuse that lack of accountability in other people's behavior. With all due respect, your post typifies that lack of accountability mindset to me. IMO you're not accountable if someone loses money at poker and you get a piece of it. It's that simple to me.

[adios]

[ QUOTE ]
The bottom line is that you're not producing anything when you play poker.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sure you are. Your producing a profit for people which they can either consume products with or use as investment capital. If I buy stocks and live off the profits from buying those stocks what am I producing? If I'm a minister and am paid by a church to preach there, what am I producing? Consumption == production more or less. Just look how GDP is calculated and you'll see that it's true.

When you buy stocks you're providing money for business expansion and capital growth (directly and indirectly). If you're a minister, you're providing a tangible service to people (offering guidance, support, social interaction).

Using your logic, you're also producing something when you steal $20 off an old lady or win the lottery, then go and buy something with that money.

My point is more subtle than that anyway. I'm not here to say what is and what isn't useful for society. But when you play poker, the only thing you use your talents and intelligence for is to make money for yourself. You sit in front a computer screen clicking buttons, producing no tangible good or service and having no real social interaction. If it's for entertainment, and you have a real job or are studying, fine. But if it's your life and career, and you do nothing else, you're just a leech. Most people who play poker professionally would say 'who cares?' That's your choice, but realise that welfare recipients say the same thing, and are just as useful for society as professional poker players. Don't think you're anything more than that.

I'm not trying to be an [censored] or anything, but people need to realise this. For example, there are threads about kids dropping out of college to play poker. They need to see the profession for what it is.

[BluffTHIS!]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The bottom line is that you're not producing anything when you play poker.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sure you are. Your producing a profit for people which they can either consume products with or use as investment capital. If I buy stocks and live off the profits from buying those stocks what am I producing? If I'm a minister and am paid by a church to preach there, what am I producing? Consumption == production more or less. Just look how GDP is calculated and you'll see that it's true.

[/ QUOTE ]

Professional poker players provide entertainment for casual players and chastisement for wannabe pros. It's as simple as that. This is no different than being in a business that provides other forms of recreational entertainment, paid admission sports being an example. As long as a professional player does not take unfair advantage or hustle degenerates who cannot afford it to play, then he is just providing a venue for casual players. If it weren't for pros, most games wouldn't get started nearly as easy online or b&m. And since the vast majority of pros pay their taxes and invest their savings, then they are indeed being productive members of society.

[ceskylev]

[ QUOTE ]

Not quite. Work builds the economy and provides for future development. It feeds, clothes, houses and transports people, and creates a functional society. Different ballpark. Poker creates nothing at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're correct about the game of poker. However, the lifestyle of a pro player creates opportunities to do good works, no? If you use that free time to make art or volunteer or take your kids to the park, who's to say you're not contributing to society?

[Aytumious]

[ QUOTE ]
When you buy stocks you're providing money for business expansion and capital growth (directly and indirectly). If you're a minister, you're providing a tangible service to people (offering guidance, support, social interaction).

Using your logic, you're also producing something when you steal $20 off an old lady or win the lottery, then go and buy something with that money.

My point is more subtle than that anyway. I'm not here to say what is and what isn't useful for society. But when you play poker, the only thing you use your talents and intelligence for is to make money for yourself. You sit in front a computer screen clicking buttons, producing no tangible good or service and having no real social interaction. If it's for entertainment, and you have a real job or are studying, fine. But if it's your life and career, and you do nothing else, you're just a leech. Most people who play poker professionally would say 'who cares?' That's your choice, but realise that welfare recipients say the same thing, and are just as useful for society as professional poker players. Don't think you're anything more than that.

I'm not trying to be an [censored] or anything, but people need to realise this. For example, there are threads about kids dropping out of college to play poker. They need to see the profession for what it is.

[/ QUOTE ]

I see. So you are just worried about the children.

You're points are ridiculous, especially the comparison of professional poker players to welfare whores.

We live in a society based on capitalistic ideals. If you can make a living in a way that is legal, with the participants taking part voluntarily, that is your right. If you want everyone to have a job that can be shown to tangibly benefit the whole, move to a socialist country. The overwhelming majority work mainly for their paychecks; the societal benefits of thier jobs are merely side effects.

Thier certainly exist examples of people that you describe, but to paint the entire professional poker community as a pack of scum is unwarranted.