Daily Hand Post : KJo in LMP

[Evan]

Most likely a bluff, a 5 or a 6.

EDIT: By 'bluff' I mean a continuation of a semi bluff, not something completely random, most likely.

[GuyOnTilt]

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I play AK or AJ the same way, FWIW.

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what about AQ? it seems by your omission you bet, but then what other legit hands do you checkraise?

(I say legit not in terms of winning when called or getting him to fold, but in terms of "beating an ace kicker")

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Hey DMB,

I'm betting a full house or a pocket pair better than 9's here. He won't bluff a whole lot with busted draws, but there's no way he's folding an Ace here. He'll bet both sometimes of course, but I think I'm losing a bet versus an Ace that checks through more often than I'm going to gain a bet by checking here.

So yeah, basically I'm not check-raising any legitimate hands here besides Ace high, which really is actually a pretty good hand here against his range. I check-raise the river very often with strong holdings after betting the turn and getting called HU though, so I'm able to cover for the times I bluff c/r or value-bluff c/r, AK and AJ in this hand being a good example.

GoT

[GuyOnTilt]

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I don't know about at those limits, but down at 2/4 and 3/6 there are alot of guys who can play a Q or a 9 this way. With a specific read this makes more sense to me, but against unknowns at those levels I think it's just spewing.

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You're right in that I wouldn't advise this play against a complete unknown at those limits or a guy who consistenly weird-plays. Against a semi-decent or somewhat thinking or capable opponent I think this is the play, even at 2/4 thru 5/10 full.

GoT

[Luv2DriveTT]

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After I finished playing last night I was watching GoT and then played for him while he went to look for something. After he came back I kept playing while he watched and this hand came up. If it hadn't been for the combination of talking with him about similar plays and this thread I would NEVER have thought of this play. As soon as the river card hit I thought it looked like a good place to try to steal the pot, then he said, "see, this is a spot where I'd try a river check raise." I haven't had a moment like that, where something completely new clicked, in long time...it was pretty exciting.

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Tell us about the Button Evan, what were his stats like? Is he the type of player that can fold 56s here? A5o? 5x? Ax? I like this play a lot, knowing more about the opponent helps us get into the groove.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[Evan]

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Is he the type of player that can fold 56s here? A5o? 5x? Ax?

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No one is folding any of those hands, other than 5x, ever.

Button is 37/19.5/1.56 over 1662 hands.

[PokerBob]

.....not becuase it is a bad move, but because it should only be applied vs. the right opponent at the right time. Most of the people who read this forum play 2/4 or 3/6. This happened in a 30/60 game, where I am sure the player dynamic and skill level is much different. I am not trying to be critical of Evan or GoT, I just would hate to see a lot of 2/4 players getting carried away with this. At 30/60 this is an advanced, expert play. At 2/4 or 3/6 it is FPS.

[krishanleong]

I don't like it. Here are my thoughts.

Button cold calls a raise preflop. Against the kinda guy who folds to check raises, I'll put his range at 22-TT, JTs, and other suited faces.

He calls the flop. Could be in order of likelyhood 88-22, JT, AcXc, a 9, a Q.

He calls the turn. I really doubt he has a 9 and I think it moderately unlikely that he has a Q. I still think a small pp is the overwhelming favorite. Could be in order of likelyhood 88-22, JT, AcXc, unlikely (a Q, a 9).

On the river, the board pairs counterfeiting a small pp. It doesn't complete the obvious straight or flush draws. So you check to induce a bluff. I'm sorta with you there but I don't understand the point of the cr. It's either for value or to fold a better (tied?) hand.

I can't see any worse hand calling so I doubt it's for value. (Occasionally online you'll see people look up a river cr with a busted draw just for info but ignoring that, it looks like a crappy value cr)

A 9 will never fold. He doesn't have a 9 though. A busted straight or flush can't call the cr. The cr has no value against these hands though. A call would be just as good.

I don't think ace high folds here. It also seems unlikely that he has Ace high here. AT, AJ maybe but unlikely.

I could see him folding KJ, KT to the cr. But I don't think these hands comprise enough of his hand range to make the river cr better than just calling.

The same analysis holds true for you having AK, or AJ. Thanks for the post,

Krishan

[gaming_mouse]

Krishan,

I like your analysis. I am very curious to see how GoT responds to it. GoT?

[krishanleong]

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I like your analysis.

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Thanks!

<font color="white"> really just a bump </font>

Krishan

[PokerSparky]

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30/60 Hold'em (3 handed)

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This is a vital detail to this post IMO.