Beyond 15/30 (online)

[Nate tha' Great]

This is a little bit of a follow up to Barron's (dcifrths) post in Mid-Stakes the other week.

The world of limit hold 'em beyond the 20/40 level (the highest limit that the Chicago B&Ms can be counted on to spread with any regularity) is still a murky one to me. I realized the other night that I'm not entirely comfortable in playing above these limits ... and then I realized shortly afterward that I've really logged very few hours in games at these limits. I've played the Party 30/60 I'd guess a total of 15-20 sessions, have taken a couple of cracks at the Pacific 30/60 since I've got money left over in that account, and have a handful of B&M sessions at 30/60 and 40/80 between Chicago and Vegas ... that works out to I'm guessing like 3-5% of the cards that I've played in the past year. Not a lot.

Let's assume for purposes of this discussion that bankroll is not an issue, which is pretty close to the truth in terms of the limits that I'd be contemplating paying. Multi-part question:

1) Should moving up to higher limit ring games be a high priority for me? Or should I focus on things like my tournament game instead?

2) Which online games, specifically, should I be looking to play? (please feel more than free to PM me if you do not want to divulge any trade secrets)

3) Are things like collusion more of a concern at these limits? (Fewer players, smaller sites, etc.).

thanks,
Nate

[Perseus]

Have you tried the pokerstars 100/200 games. I am interested how these games play as I have heard some super LAGS play regularly.

[J_V]

Depends on what you want out of poker. If it's money, moving up is probably not that important. If it's presige, you have to move to higher limits. This used to be a tough choice for me. I've chosen money for the time being, but I'd be shocked if I don't eventually end up playing almost 100% for prestige and ego at some point in the next ten years.

[Evan]

1) Personally I have no motivation to learn tournaments because they're just really boring to me. I know some people who are very good cash players that are in the process of learning them now so I guess that's a personal thing. If you think it would be fun then why not go for it.

2) I've never played that high but I have watched some of the bigger games a bit when I was bored. The 40/80 on Paradise looks really good a lot so that might be a good place to start.

3) No idea.

[USS Gut Shot]

Sometimes the 100-200 game on stars looks quite good.

Tournaments are a lot of fun. Very different from cash game where you can reload and come and go as you please. The rising blinds and finality can make them very exciting.

[geormiet]

I'm glad to see this question, as I am in the same situation.

Is moving to Los Angeles or Las Vegas out of the question for you?

I live in Los Angeles. My plan is to continue to 4 table party 15/30 as my bread and butter, while moving up limits in the live games as my bankroll dictates.

[Nate tha' Great]

[ QUOTE ]
Is moving to Los Angeles or Las Vegas out of the question for you?

[/ QUOTE ]

There's an outside chance I'd move to LA for reasons unrelated to poker, but for the most part, yeah.

[cwl]

i think moving up in limits is worthwhile. the most productive way to look at it is a little different than the transition through the lower limits though. its not so much that you should be trying to change yourself from a 15-30 player into a 100-200 player, or whatever. its that you should try to get comfortable with the higher limits such that when there are worthwhile opprotunities you are able to take advantage of them. a lot of the time higher limit games are a waste of time for decent but not great players but there are also a fair number of opprotunities to sit in an outstanding higher limit game. if you are comfortable with the limit and disciplined about your game selection you can take advantage of these opprotunities, which are obviously worth a lot.

paradise isnt a bad place to play as a next step. i havent played there that much in the last couple months but i played in the 20-40 and 40-80 most of last year and for the most part the games were pretty decent. also, given the limits they have and the crossover between the player pool of the 20-40 and 40-80 you can gain some familiarity with the players at a limit your more comfortable with and sort of gradually transition to a slightly higher limit.

it becomes much more important to be objective and realistic about your own abilities as you start playing in higher limit games. game selection matters at the mid limits but in all probability it means the differece between a game in which you can win a lot and a game in which you can win a little. at the higher limit games it probably means the difference between a game in which you are a winner and a game in which you are a loser. often it will be the case that you are sitting in a game with 8 good players and a superfish. if you are a decent but not great player its important that you are realistic about this, when the superfish gets up you need to stop playing, whether you are up money or down. if you go about it correctly there are many great opprotunities in higher limit games, if your stubborn and unrealistic there are many chances to chunk off tons of money playing against great players.

[Pawtucket Pat]

I don't play higher than 5/10 right now, but I was watching a paradise 40/80 game on saturday that had 35% to the flop. Granted I only had the table open for about half an hour, but I saw some horrific play. One guy called 2 cold pf with Q8s, and called down his mid-pair of 8s. I doubt its always that good, but you might want to check it out.

[La Brujita]

Excellent post!