Bet into the PFR or check raise the field?

Vern · #1 03-04-2005, 11:46 AM

Preface: I don't think I check/raise enough so I am looking to places to do it.

Table is nice and loose.

CO has obviously just sat down.
UTG+1 is loose and passive before and after the flop
MP1 is tight and aggressive preflop, tight but not as aggressive post flop.
MP2 is loose and passive before and after the flop
BB looks tight and passive, only one orbit but nothing crazy.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (9 handed)
Props to Bison for his converter

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. CO posts a blind of $0.5.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls, CO (poster) raises, 2 folds, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (12.50 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, Hero ?

If I bet and CO raises, there will still be 15.5sb in the pot, with people calling 2, they are getting 7.75:1 and I doubt many will fold. I think there is a better chance CO will bet if checked too than raise if I bet into him. If they are likely to call two anyway, I want them to call two and check raise this field here? I think if he bets at least 2 others will call. I am about 2.25:1 to fill up or 4OAK by the river. Is this a good spot to check raise or am I moving towards FPSitis? Should I want people to fold incorrectly (when they had odds to call) since the pot is already getting big? Also, I cannot three-bet him if he raises me and check/raising may shut CO down. I am very confused.

Vern

Standard Disclaimer, I am by no means an expert at any of this.

davelin · #2 03-04-2005, 11:49 AM

Hmmm...pretty big pot and highly draw-heavy board. I'm betting the flop for the small chance that it gets checked through and if the PFR raises forcing others to cold-call two, I wouldn't be unhappy with that.

Peter Harris · #3 03-04-2005, 11:51 AM

ditto.

NateDog · #4 03-04-2005, 11:54 AM

I'd bet out there. The flop probably missed the PFR (and if it didn't, you have outs), so he may just call rather than raise. Him raising is not that bad either, as like you said, the pot is getting large, and you want to win it now.

Nate

Vern · #5 03-04-2005, 11:55 AM

I agree on not letting it get checked through, but..

1) Should I be concentrating on building a pot since I cannot really protect my hand?
2) If one is true, will a check/raise grow the pot more than a bet with the potential to three-bet if CO raises me?

Vern

droolie · #6 03-04-2005, 11:57 AM

It would royally suck if this unknown villian checked through his overcards. I bet this flop. This is a draw heavy board and you're likely to get a nice pot built up. If villian raises I 3-bet if everyone calls. If it's HU (or two players left) I call and C/R the turn.

I usually like to C/R to protect or to trap on an expensive street when I have a monster. I will trap on the flop if I'm in EP and the the raiser is on my immediate left and there are many players still in. There is less chance of the flop getting checked through.

KingOtter · #7 03-04-2005, 11:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
ditto.

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davelin · #8 03-04-2005, 11:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I agree on not letting it get checked through, but..

1) Should I be concentrating on building a pot since I cannot really protect my hand?

[/ QUOTE ]

You can protect your hand by betting by hoping that the pre-flop raiser will raise you.

JerseyTom · #9 03-04-2005, 12:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Hmmm...pretty big pot and highly draw-heavy board. I'm betting the flop for the small chance that it gets checked through and if the PFR raises forcing others to cold-call two, I wouldn't be unhappy with that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed.

The pot is an OK size now and very draw-heavy; I'd do everything I could to take it down now. Letting this flop get checked through would be a disaster.

Bet out and hope that CO helps you by raising. You want this to happen so that you can force lone 7's out (or at least make them call getting the wrong price). You probably cannot make it incorrect for 4's or diamond draws to call. 3-bet the flop if given the opportunity.

Hope it held up...

Tom

tytygoodnuts · #10 03-04-2005, 12:02 PM

Your pot equity is extremely high here. I would check-raise. You aren't getting a flush draw to fold. The preflop raiser will most likely bet. A successful check/raise will be very profitable.