Getting Raised on the Turn... - Page 2

#11 08-09-2005, 03:10 PM

nah most of the time you cant, because your unsure of the read and its better to loose 1 bet than loose a whole pot trying to save one bet... If Im real sure im beat, ill fold UI, but I have to be very very sure

#12 08-09-2005, 03:11 PM

aggression of 1 is low, if this guys raising me, im considering a fold here..
cdl

fizzleboink · #13 08-09-2005, 03:18 PM

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aggression of 1 is low, if this guys raising me, im considering a fold here..
cdl

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nah most of the time you cant, because your unsure of the read and its better to loose 1 bet than loose a whole pot trying to save one bet... If Im real sure im beat, ill fold UI, but I have to be very very sure

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So an agg. factor of 1 suddenly makes you very very sure?
What are you considering? That's what the crux of my thread is about... what considerations make you swing to one button instead of the other? And 1 is just an arbitrary number I pulled out of a hat.. do you call down at 1.1, 1.2? 1.3?

chaz64 · #14 08-09-2005, 03:19 PM

I usually become a fish and call down in this situation. Against one villain there is a decent chance he is bluffing. Against two or more the pot is usually big enough to call down, considering he usually has two pair (if he's not bluffing) and you have enough outs to improve (including hidden outs).

fizzleboink · #15 08-09-2005, 03:25 PM

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I usually become a fish and call down in this situation. Against one villain there is a decent chance he is bluffing. Against two or more the pot is usually big enough to call down, considering he usually has two pair (if he's not bluffing) and you have enough outs to improve (including hidden outs).

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Do you call his 2-pair on the river when you don't improve? I have, and it seems so stupid every time I do it.

"I know you have 2-pair but I can't bring myself to laying down 1 pair, here's my money."

#16 08-09-2005, 03:28 PM

If the player is totally unaggressive, and picks up major aggression, I will fold pending pot odds calculation, note here even if your behind, its correct to call! I might fold this hand like 1/50 times,

Unaggressive for me is defined as .99 or less pretty much. Depends on what you feel comfortable with calling unaggressive. I feel like normal aggression is around 1.3 or so, and I average like 1.65
cdl

chaz64 · #17 08-09-2005, 03:29 PM

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Do you call his 2-pair on the river when you don't improve? I have, and it seems so stupid every time I do it.

"I know you have 2-pair but I can't bring myself to laying down 1 pair, here's my money."

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Heads up I do. With someone else in the hand it depends on the river card and my position. Example: someone to act behind me was just passively calling and a flush card hits on the river, I'm much more likely to fold.

fizzleboink · #18 08-09-2005, 03:42 PM

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Heads up I do. With someone else in the hand it depends on the river card and my position. Example: someone to act behind me was just passively calling and a flush card hits on the river, I'm much more likely to fold.

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Ya someone else hanging on for the ride definitely makes me suspicious and I will fold more often in a spot like the one you describe.

fizzleboink · #19 08-09-2005, 04:13 PM

Here's a post for a hand I just found in SS that helped me in these kinds of spots:

Correct to call down?

Read W. Deranged's post in particular. A 7 BB threshold, I like it.

Although in my example it's 8 BB which still isn't an obvious call-down in my opinion, but it's something to think about.

aces_dad · #20 08-09-2005, 04:24 PM

There is one good thing about bet/calling a turn raise, is that when you improve to what you now feel is the best hand, you are in good shape to execute a c/r on the river, as the one thing which almost always happens is that villian follows up the turn raise with a river bet.

Against standard villians it takes at least 2 pair and sometimes more to make this move though, which is why I try to note what players 'suddenly' raise with on the turn.

When multiple people on the table start c/r the turn with ragged 2 pairs and sets instead of just leading with them, unless the table is otherwise profitable, I will likely look for a new 1/2 table. I can't say if 2/4 is more likely to have these type of players or not as I don't play that level.