SB situation

oreogod · #1 08-23-2005, 09:09 AM

question:

15/30 game. Early limper (no reads), everyone folds to u in SB...u hold K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Do you raise or complete? Does a 1/2 or 1/3 blind structure change your desicion?

Yes, I know we all love preflop questions. Blame Ciaffone, I came across this and was just curious to what u think.

Jeffage · #2 08-23-2005, 09:19 AM

I'm playing and if I'm playing, I'd rather raise and get the BB out potentially. EP may have limped with a small pair or something that could allow you to steal if flop comes ace high, etc.

Jeff

stoxtrader · #3 08-23-2005, 09:36 AM

IFl imper is tight, complete, if he is loose raise.

the exact answer to this question would involve running his exact ranges.

Jeffage · #4 08-23-2005, 09:47 AM

Sometimes you don't have this luxury (say, at a live table or someone you've never seen online). So, how about just playing poker? I think the default is to raise.

Jeff

elindauer · #5 08-23-2005, 12:22 PM

I would complete. You are out of position with a hand that has domination concerns (KQ, AJ for the EP limper). I don't mind the big blind coming along, as I will generally only continue if I hit the flop, I can't possible fold anything dominates me, and I don't want to fold anything I dominate.

Additionally, I don't think most players play well in tiny little 3 SB pots like this, as they bluff and payoff far too much. I enjoy playing hands in these pots.

my 2 cents.
Eric

elindauer · #6 08-23-2005, 12:25 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm playing and if I'm playing, I'd rather raise and get the BB out potentially.

[/ QUOTE ]

What are you hoping the big blind is going to fold? KQ, AK, AJ and all pocket pairs are all surely coming along.

[ QUOTE ]
EP may have limped with a small pair or something that could allow you to steal if flop comes ace high, etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is true, but it's not clear to me that you need to make this extra investment preflop to make stealing on such a board possible. Can't you just bet the flop? Clearly the preflop raise gives you a bit more credibility, but it also is more expensive when you lose.

Good luck.
Eric

elindauer · #7 08-23-2005, 12:29 PM

If you raise, you are making a move, hoping to take it down unimproved. You cannot really feel that you have a pot equity edge with this hand, can you? Note that you have to both have an equity edge and feel that it overcomes your positional disadvantage. KJ doesn't qualify.

Raising is ok as a change up. You'll certainly steal the pot plenty of times if you have a tight image. But the default, I believe, is to call.

my 2 cents.
Eric

DcifrThs · #8 08-23-2005, 12:30 PM

its pretty close at 30/60 and very dependent upon stats of limper and position. more likely he is to limp w/ something like AJ or KQ then less likely i am to raise.

at 15/30, one consideration is you get better odds on your raise (2:1:1 vs. the 1.667 at 30)

-Barron

NYplayer · #9 08-23-2005, 12:38 PM

this is an easy one. it's a clear call. the chance of getting it heads up AND winning out of position are far outweighed by your ability to steal on rag flops and get extra bets on K or J high flops.

Schneids · #10 08-23-2005, 02:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]
this is an easy one. it's a clear call. the chance of getting it heads up AND winning out of position are far outweighed by your ability to steal on rag flops and get extra bets on K or J high flops.

[/ QUOTE ]

NYplayer plays goooood. I agree and that's why.