Turned set with 4 to the flush on board

marchron · #1 06-05-2005, 06:18 AM

The table was somewhat loose. Villain is aggressive but not always tight.

Advice on all streets, please.

.50/1, 9-handed

Preflop: marchron is SB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
5 folds, CO raises, BT folds, marchron reraises, BB folds, CO calls.

Flop: (7 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
marchron bets, CO raises, marchron reraises, CO calls.

Turn: (6.5 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
marchron bets, CO calls.

River: (8.5 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
marchron bets, CO calls.

Final Pot: 10 BB (after rake)

Should I have handled it differently, or did I play a bad board the best I could?

Kevin K. · #2 06-05-2005, 06:26 AM

Looks standard to me. Only thing to consider really is what didn't happen: Do you fold if he raises the river?

aK13 · #3 06-05-2005, 06:31 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Looks standard to me. Only thing to consider really is what didn't happen: Do you fold if he raises the river?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd say yes.

Kevin K. · #4 06-05-2005, 07:15 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Looks standard to me. Only thing to consider really is what didn't happen: Do you fold if he raises the river?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd say yes.

[/ QUOTE ]

[img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Nyack · #5 06-05-2005, 07:18 AM

Looks good.

yellowjack · #6 06-05-2005, 07:22 AM

you're vs. a known 2+2er. Do you fold to the river raise, checkraise the river, or 3-bet it? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Kevin K. · #7 06-05-2005, 07:32 AM

Heading into metagame territory now, hehe.

marchron · #8 06-05-2005, 11:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Looks standard to me. Only thing to consider really is what didn't happen: Do you fold if he raises the river?

[/ QUOTE ]

Like Snoop Dogg almost said: I'd release it as if its radiant heat exceeded comfortable parameters of my dermal and subdermal tissues.

If he raises, I'm getting 11-1. Only a complete fool or a complete psycho would raise that board without a decent-sized spade, and this guy is neither. I'd be 91.667% sure that he has any spade, and any spade beats me.

Results and my thoughts in white below: 
marchron has Qc Qh (three of a kind, queens).
CO has 6s 6h (flush, queen-high).
Outcome: CO wins 10 BB.

Unfrickinbelievable. Turn the hypothetical around: you're the CO, what do you call me with? I don't know what the hell he was thinking. But then again: I never once saw him show down a statistically "bad" hand unless it won.

In retrospect, I should have left the table about half an hour sooner. I'd made almost $20 in the two hours I was there, and I was about to leave since all the fish had ditched, but decided I'd play until my big blind again. Sure enough, in my last hand, UTG, I picked up aces and during the play of that hand the table filled back up again. I was winning and stupid and figured I could stick around. After this beat and another to the same frickin' guy when he beat my A/Ks with 10/8off, I finally walked with a $2.25 profit.

Fantam · #9 06-05-2005, 12:24 PM

I think that you played this hand correctly.

Your PF 3-bet is fine. CO could easily have AK,AQ,JJ,TT or 99 all of which you would be ahead of.

Your flop bet is correct because it protects your hand. CO raising suggests that he does have a pocket pair but not necessarily AA or KK. I like your flop 3-bet, because when CO just calls it suggests that he probably doesnt have AA or KK.

I think you had to bet the turn. If CO does have a pocket pair he hasnt got the flush. And if CO had overcards, he would have to have had specifically something like A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] or A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. to have the flush.

On the river, I also think you are correct to bet. If you check and CO does have the flush, he will bet and so it will still cost you a bet to call. And if you have CO beat you will have lost a bet by not betting.

Finally, if CO raises you on the river, I would probably still call, as I think that it would be possible for him to attempt a bluff in this situation, particularly if he is an agressive player.

Fantam · #10 06-05-2005, 12:33 PM

That last bit about leaving the table when you are ahead does not really hold up.

Articles have been written about this subject of so called "money management" being a waste of time.

The point is that poker is a long-run game, and that how long you play for makes no difference to your win rate. The only thing that does matter is how well you play.

That said, yes it does give you a nice feeling to leave a table up, and if that is important to you then thats fine.

But its important to realise that it has no influence on whether you would have won more or lost if you played for longer. Unless you were tired or there was some other reason for your no longer playing at your best.