Am I one of THEM?

[Taraz]

So I was playing 3-6 in a brick and mortar earlier this week when I found myself in an interesting scenario. We were playing 9-handed, the dealer has to post a live $3 bet, and there were at least 6 people in on every flop and normally about 3 left by the river.

In this particular hand, UTG calls, UTG+1 raises, two people cold-call, one folds, and then the action is to me one off the button. There was $25 in the pot at that point and it would cost me $6 to call. The table was generally pretty passive and fishy. UTG+1 was the type of player who liked to play 96o utg because "69 never loses" and had raised previously from OOP with A2s and 66.

So I take a look at my cards and see J9s. What would you guys do here? I elected to flat call and in hindsight I probably should have folded. I contemplated raising to get out the blinds and the dealer's 3 chips, but then I reasoned that they probably wouldn't want to miss out on this "action" hand. I was also a bit scared of a cap behind me or from the original bettor.

How bad was my call? I was thinking that I could take down a huge pot here, but now I'm scared that I was just chasing the "action". The flop was kind to me, but I'm trying not to be too results oriented, so any comments would be appreciated.

[deception5]

I don't think this is that bad at all. You're calling a raise, but you have good position, a hand that plays well multi-way and the flop is likely to be at least 5-6 way.

[slogger]

In a very passive game, when 5-7 of your opponents will be seeing the flop, I think you can make this marginal call (the $3 button post helps, but I'd like it better if you were the button yourself).

[shant]

I'm not worried as long as you play well post-flop.

[dtbog]

[ QUOTE ]
I contemplated raising to get out the blinds and the dealer's 3 chips

[/ QUOTE ]

Why are you trying to get people out?

I don't mind the PF call at all -- but some might, and I'll leave that disagreement to the tight players on this board -- but I think your logic is backwards. You made the correct play by not raising, because you want to keep people IN! You're in position with a suited, connecting hand.

I'm sure a more experienced fixed-limit player can explain the concept of multi-way vs. heads-up hands as it applies to Limit HE (without bumbling it up like I would), but think about this:

- If you have AKo, you don't want five people seeing the flop. Everyone will be correctly drawing against you if you flop an ace, and someone will probably hit.

- If you have J9s, you do want five people seeing the flop. UTG+1 will flop an ace with his AKo, but he won't be able to protect it, and you'll have more than sufficent odds to try to complete your straight or flush.

-dB

[Taraz]

The reason I want to get people out is that it would be great to get hands that dominate mine to fold. A competent player would fold A9, AJ, KJ, QJ, Axs, etc. to a 3-bet, but could conceivably call for only 2 bets. Does this concept not apply with suited connectors/one-gappers?

[dtbog]

[ QUOTE ]
Does this concept not apply with suited connectors/one-gappers?

[/ QUOTE ]

I see what you're getting at, but it doesn't seem to outweigh the benefits of keeping A9 in there when you flop a flush draw on a board containing an ace.

Also -- if you raise, a nine flops, and it happens to be top pair, are you going to play it as if your raise forced A9 to fold? Still seems dangerous to me.

Thirdly -- if I'm one of the two callers and I have KJs, I'm not going to fold for one more bet. Same for the button with his one bet already in. BB, maybe.

...if everyone in this game folds KJ to a three-bet, though, then your pond isn't very well stocked!

-dB